victorian rachuig teams

[Abuse]

Yes i have bowled at numerouse Trials and even made the team, i have seen guys miss spares and even throw 2 after 5 in a row to let their mate who is struggling beat them to get the 30 bonus pins to help them (YES I KNOW WE DNOT HAVE 30 BOUNUS NOW)
Even seen one of Australias Top Male Bowlers throw the ball in the right hand gutter at 15 feet when going for a 7 pin to lose the match.. And yes there is a circle in bowling, if you havent noticed this..well.

The bowlers you mention hardly bowl in any Tournament apart from TROTTER, MAC and FLYNN. This is where Vic has the problem.
Not enough bowlers who bowl in the TOP competitions around AUS.. Yeh i know not enough Money to travel ETC,ETC. but look at most teams from other states and count the number of players that bowl / chase the Super 6.

Im not knocking these other VIC bowlers but we lack depth and experience.

Look back to when we were a power, most of the team members bowled in all the Majors.

The situation has gotten worse with no ATBA in VIC and not enough tournament for people who cannot afford to travel.

 

[AdrianS]

Any decisions made on costs, dates and sites for 2004 rolloffs yet?, the quicker i know, the sooner i can get those $ to one side. Carna Vics, no better chance to bring it home than on home turf.

 

[chucker]

abuse do you have any interest in trying out next year or do you lack super six experience as well.when you refer to other states one of the reasons thier cream make the team is they do selection.you and a lot of people disagree with selection that is fine but do you have any ideas on any other ways of trialing.one more thing abuse have you been in a winning team in the last 10 years to know what it really takes to win rachuig we didn't have all stars with experience when we pulled it off in 2000 one of the greatest team efforts i have been part of.adrian apparently all the trials will be at forest hill that is all we know at the moment we look forward to seeing you at the trials next year

 

[Roo Boy]

Well all i know is that ill be there trying out.

Put me down.

I just hope we can get the best team on the lanes.

Well who is everyones opinion on what team they rekon would be the best?

Roo Boy.

 

[chucker]

cant wait to see you there roo boy you will have to talk chucky into it after he whipped your ass at emerson he would be a good asset

 

[Roo Boy]

Yeah will be doin so mate. He didnt kick my ass, He beat me first time and i beat him second time head to head.

But being serious i rekon there is know reason why Vic cant put a team together and kick some serious ass.

I hope heaps try out.

Deano

 

[chucker]

trotts and i fully agree with you

 

[Abuse]

I Might try out, depends on the format. If selection is used for 6 + 7 forget it. I dont see the point of bowling better than some one else and not been rewarded especially when it cost so much.

My opinion the best 7 out of the trials should bowl, what happens if the condition is very near to what was at the trial when the teams are on, Why should someone who performed less have the opportunity to re prove they can perform after someone else has already proved it?

You dont get a second chance to make the cut in any tournaments, look at Warrnambool, a few people should of performed better there and didnt.

No i was not in a winning team and i haven't bowled in a major tournament for a few years.

 

[crazzzed]

First i would like to say that whether the 2004 team is a 5+2 selection or 7 past the post i will be giving it a go (work permitting). I have seen it from both side through my own experiences and my dads. he bowled through the 80's while it was a 5+2 selection and back then i believe their was abit of an in crowd, which meant you had to make top 5 to ensure a spot. However i would like to say now i dont believe vic bowling is the same, sure there are groups of friends but i dont believe that it would influence the selection process these days. Bowlers that i see going around at the moment are more interrested in winning and i believe that would be the driving force in selections if it went that way.

I have tried out a few times and even made it once and i have found all the bowlers involved to be great to bowl with. If you're wondering i was part of the 2000 winning team. We had a combination of experience and new blood (i guess you could call it that). I dont think too many people gave us a chance but we came together as a team and got the job done. I agree with chucker that it was one of the greatest efforts i've been involved in over my 20+ years of bowling.

Now for a format/selection criteria i think that it will still work either way 5+2 or top 7 finish. The secret is to workout the qualifying, i think it should be in either a 4 or 5 man format maybe over 3 weekends. This will give bowlers who are able to hold their focus over a longer game to excel as aposed to the bowler who excells at a fast following game that you get when there are only 4 or 5 per pair. Also with the trials being over an extended time, lets say one weekend each month for 3 months we would find that the bowlers who can continuely perform will rise to the top. Personally i like the 7 past the post criteria but i have no problems with the 5+2 either. I am not one of those bowlers that would probably jump to mind during this sort of selection but if its going to help create that winning belief (ie Brisbane Lions) that not matter whats in front of you, you will make it happen i will support it.

Now speaking of support I remember a time when we would have 50, 60 even 70 total bowlers trying out for trials to Rachuig so i put this to all the vic bowlers out their, if we get the numbers of the past turning up to try out in 2004 then my company, Earthquake Advertising will put forward $500 sponsorship to the team to help cover costs (shirts, lineage, etc.). I know its not much to be spread over 14 members and support staff but its a start and hopefully i can help to make the rachuig experience in reach of more bowlers.

Well i think i have said enough and i hope to see you all in 2004 at Forrest Hill.

Regards
Brett

 

[chucker]

i had two objectives for starting this post the main one was to get the best team bowlers to try out and secondly to get feedback from everyone who wants to try out a chance to tell us what they want as i am hoping to take this info to the state committee when they discuss it as they should know what the majority actually want.i thank everyone for their feedback even yours abuse hopefully we see you at the trials next year the more the merrier.thankyou brett for your reply and hopfully you can talk some of your winning dunn shield team mates into giving rachuig a chance next year including nods as he had a great weekend and him and his sister should give rachuig another chance it would be great to have them there.everyone keep the feedback going for will will have a great team next year.
thanks mac stewart

 

[bowlrig]

Although i have trialed for Rachuig the last three years and been most unsuccessful (but will be trying again in 2004), I think some of the ideas above could be implemented to Rachuig trials to make the team more successful. I disagree with the 5+2 concept as it will in the future and has in the past discouraged some good bowlers from trying out again, thus a loss for the Vic's.
I think two trials, the first (in four person teams) on pinfall and the second head to head with pinfall dropped, would be sufficient, but should be bowled in five man teams. The second trial could be over two weekends a month apart as suggested because of the extra time needed to complete games.
As with Mac's suggestion with the Allstar bowlers from team events, maybe the state committee could draft a letter to these bowlers explaining why they could/would be a benefit to the Vic team if they made the team, they could invite them to trial rather than just sending out bulk envelopes of entry forms. The personal touch never goes astray.
I think the State committee needs to become a little more approachable and avail themselves to all bowlers statewide.
Proper coaching platforms need to be built for both the men's and women's teams, no bowler is above needing help or advice.
Above all though this year all trials should be at Forest Hill on the condition that is going to be used for the Nationals. Surely the management and/or the head tech should know or be able to find out from the TBA what is going to be the required lane condition.
As for country bowlers not bring accepted into these groups or cliques or whatever you may call them, my wife Lisa and myself have over the last four years been accepted by the city bowlers and have made many good friends along the way, not just from Melbourne but from all over the country. By the way we live 600 km's from Melbourne.
Mac, maybe a petition style letter to the State Committee, carefully outlineing what the bowlers would like to see implemented and signed by those bowlers willing to trial may be of benefit to help arrive at some successful changes.

Anyway I'm sure to think of something else soon.

Rob

 

[philby]

After spectating at the presidents shield tryouts for a few years i agree that all rolloffs for state team (couldnt remember how to spell rockway lol) should be held at Forest Hill. It worked for victoria presidents shield them they won. THe format qualifing over 14 games top 16 bowl 15 games head to head with 10 pins bonus (not 30 pins as before) Pinfall dropped after qualifing. Spread it out over 3 weekends. Take top 6 and allow for any unfortunate incerdents like injury on the last day or whatever. Of course if all goes well the 7th bowler is selected. You would hate for your top qualifier to pull a hammy with 2 games to go and miss out. Just my 2 bobs worth. Im no were near good enough but i will be having a go you never know i might get lucky lol

Phil

 

[milkman]

Seriously, regardless of the condition, if you are good enough, you'll make the top 7

The only reason I could think that 5+2 would be useful is through injury. But if you go and look at say olympic selection, if you are injured at selection time, you just dont make the team.

 

[crazzzed]

format for trials

ok i have been thinking about the format and process for selecting the best team.
Here are my thoughts on a possible format...

Based on 40 entries

Weekend 1 - $100
Saturday - 6 games x 5 man teams
Sunday - 6 games x 5 man teams
cut to top 30
$100 1st highest game & $50 2nd highest game each day
(high game prizes are for bowler who are cut after weekend 1)

Weekend 2 - $100
Saturday - 6 games x 5 man teams
Sunday - 6 games x 5 man teams
cut to top 20
$200 1st highest game & $100 2nd highest game each day
(high game prizes are for bowler who are cut after weekend 2)

Weekend 3 - $100
Saturday - 6 games x 5 man teams
Sunday - 6 games x 5 man teams
prizes - 1st $300, 2nd $250, 3rd $200, 4th $180, 5th $160, 6th $150, 7th $140, 8th $130, 9th $120, 10th $110

I see it as being the top 7 at the end of this weekend making up the 2004 Victorian team. The other option i would consider is the top 6 bowlers are in the team with the 7th bowler being selected from bowlers who finished 7th, 8th, 9th or 10th. Selection panel would be made up of the organising commitee and the current 6 team members. If a reserve is required the highest placed player available from the final standings will be offered the spot.

Now with this pay as you go format and with it being in Victoria hopefully we can get good numbers in both mens and ladies trials so i have based my calculations on 40 entries. Also with the chance to get your money back with high game prizes, all bowlers have something to aim for no matter where they are positioned. After doing some rough calculations regarding lineage rates, at the end of the trials there will be some money left over to help pay for some team items. This will help ease the cost each team member has to put in to compete.

There is my 20cents worth.
Does anyone have any thoughts on it?

Regards
B

 

[skippy]

Hi Crazzed,
I like the sound of your ideas about paying some money back to those bowlers who miss the cut, however we would obviously
need to work with the state commitee on their budget as a portion
of the qualifying money is used for the eventual team.
The only other thing is that TBA (national) have only 2 strict qualifying methods for Rachug teams, and that is first 7 past the post or first 5 and select 2. So whilst the 6 and 1 method that some have spoken of is also a great idea...its actually not allowed.

Trotts

 

[crazzzed]

Hey Skip,

I thought the idea giving people a chance to get money back would help bring more bowlers to the trials. Also the pay as you go would help ease the hip pocket pressure for some but yes the figures would need to be worked out by the committee. I think though the ideas from here could help to regenerate an interrest in the rachuig event.

With the selection criteria i stand corrected i wasnt aware it was the way yoou stated. Either way if we can get people there no matter what we use we should get a very strong team... its getting bowlers to try that will help Victoria the most.

thanks for the reply

B

 

[jockey]

Great idea Brett let's hope the committee is reading!

The only problem I can see is finding 3 weekends that allow all bowlers who wish to represent the state, to do so without foregoing individual interests, like Super 6, Rankings Tournaments etc. The calendar is getting pretty packed lately.

Otherwise I think the PAYG format has to be the best alternative to the current method in use. I certainly would rather pay $300 to bowl 36 games with the possiblity of coming out square providing the running and uniform costs can be satisfied within this format. The prizemoney can then be used by the bowler to offset the costs of getting to and being at the event.

The fact all qualifying is over a 5 person team format rather than involving singles should make the proposal even more attractive.

I hear that a lot of players are put off as they do not perform well individually but can perform well in a team format. This is the right way to go as we do want the best team bowlers after all.

At least it is good to see someone trying to come up with ways to attract bowlers back to Rachuig.

I really hope this gets looked at for all its merit and taken on board by the committee.

Regards
Terry

 

[bowlrig]

Hi all,

Trotts, if what u say is correct

The only other thing is that TBA (national) have only 2 strict qualifying methods for Rachug teams, and that is first 7 past the post or first 5 and select 2. So whilst the 6 and 1 method that some have spoken of is also a great idea...its actually not allowed.

Then why was it stated at the pre Rachuig Trial meeting last year that if by extenuating circumstances a bowler, (i will use you as an example, hope you dont mind) eg. Trotts has a bout of Appendicitis after the first trial and can not bowl the second trial, he may then appeal his case to the State Committee and if they feel it is warranted you would replace the seventh spot bowler.
I am sure that this was stated by Peter Coburn.
Therefore the 6 and 1 may be able to be used.


Rob

 

[Thorpey]

Hi All,

Forgive me for sounding nieve.
Have any dates been set for the trials yet.

I have one other suggestion to Bretts idea. After the first cut to the top 20 maybe there could be a small prize for the highest scoring team at the completion of every game.

This would help people bond and play as a team during the trials + offer some experience as to what the actual event is like.

Thorpey.

 

[crazzzed]

Thorpey, thats not a bad idea. It would be interesting to hear what other people think because in essence you would be supporting others that are after the same spots you are, but on the other hand fighting together to get the cash.

As for dates i dont think the committee has sat down to work it all out yet. Hopefully they will take on board some of the ideas that the bowlers have been putting forward along with their past experiences and come up with a set of trials that will encourage a large turn out.

B