The disenchantment of tourn. bowling

[willey]

Pintech, the earliest prices I remember are (1969) 50 cents Adults 25 cents Children, Pensioners at Childrens rates, Staff at Childrens rates. Amf Centre.

People I have known over the years have told me when bowling first started, the prices were 5 shillings for adult game ( 50 cents ) 2 and Sixpence Childrens game ( 25 cents ).

If you look at it the price for Children was half the Adult rate, which is the fairest way, how they come to be 9/10's of the Adult rate is beyond me, some warped thinking along the way.

In 1969 I earned $25 a week for 6 days work, I was only a 17 years old. But as you can see the price of games started probably high and they could get away with it because of the novelty in the begining, but bowling died off in the mid 60's than started to pick up from 1972 onwards without much variation in prices, so I suppose the price was cheap for a while.

Here at Mayfield our prices are $8 for Adults, when we were AMF they were $10.90 for Adults. We have had an increase in linage since we become independent, when AMF run the Centre we averaged 12 to 13 linage, now were doing 18 and 19's. With Bennetts closed it has probably helped, but I don't notice the distressed look on people's faces when they pay for thier games anymore. lol.

willey.

 

[Rig]

Rig, You make some valid points and I don't disagree with everything you say, however government statistics 6 yrs ago, concluded that less than 1% of the population bowl on a regular basis, be it eithier league or social play. I haven't seen any current statistics but I have been inside a bowling centre for the last 6 years and I would say that figure would now be closer to 0.5% even though Australia's population has grown considerably. Your veiw of government statistics maybe less trusting than my veiw.

League bowling in my opinion is suffering from social disengagement, that the consumers maybe losing their desire and ability affiliate with others, their inclination to join social organisations and participate in group activities and their willingness to trust one another has dramatically declined over the past decade and continues to decline rapidly every year.

Sponsors only put up their $$$$$$$$ to get their name in front of the consumer, unfortunately without adequate participation numbers in league bowling the industry has very little to offer as far as exsposure is concerned. Without intervention the sport of Tenpin bowling will soon be as popular and have the same number of followers as precision swimming.

Shawn

The percentage of population bowling is dropping because of one reason only, it is getting too expensive for the average bowler to come out and bowl. Plain and simple. Look up your figures again, because a vast number of people come out once or twice a year to have a family bowl. Just ask Roy that. The reason why most of the AMF centres had low lineage is because they were aged, not well maintained, and charged the earth for the privelage. That is why the wonderbowl, the superstrike bowls in newcastle, the manhatten bowls tried something different, they provided the best available for their customers and were able to charge the higher prices, and people paid it because it was more justified. However, it does become an every once in a while proposition like going to the movies, they cost about the same, Or even going to the footy. Instead of having a product that is reasonably priced for the masses, they priced it out of the typical aussie family on a social scene. Business is business, and if you can ask $10+ a game socially and get it, good on you.
However this is about a constant customer base, which provides your centre margin and cash flow on a constant and consistent basis. A good league tournament base is money you can count on. Social play is dependant on factors. I know that there is big $$$ in social, but the leagues pay the bills. Now pintech, If you were in my centre and was satisfied with just 80 games for a shift, I would not be a happy proprietor. As a proprietor in regards to the staff, them being flat out all of the time and them whinging that they are busy would make me happy. The staffs job is not to hold up the counter. But to be actually busy.

 

[Rig]

The main factor and issue of this post needs to be reminded, and that is the tournament scene. Do I want to see it die? Not on your life. I cannot blame AMF for making a business decision. I have merely questioned their logic. To Roys credit, he has responded on this site and says pretty much, hey there is no value for money in its current way, lets all come together and come up with a new way. I am hopeful that this happens.

This issue of tournament bowling is something that we the bowlers, needs to put constructive ideas together and come up with a positive way to move forward. The youth/junior events are the most important of all. I am sure that Roy would not disagree. I solid circuit to keep their interest and to have them striving towards a direction. If these kids are in the bowls, then they are not out on the streets doing god knows what. They are learning discipline, problem solving, building self confidence/worth, and learn how to set and reach goals.

I cannot speak for the other states, I do not live there. I know your tournament scene was not as developed, and for that I am truly sorry. NSW was fortunate and we knew it. On the tournament arguement, there does have to be value for money both ways, centres and bowlers.

For the independant centres, please advertise the events that you are having, and apply for ratings points. I know that Chester Hill has an event on in June sometime. I don't know of any more, but there just might be.

I have a deep seeded belief in this game. I coach because I owe this sport heaps. I met a wife, won a few tourneys, shot a few perfect games, met some great mates, competed in numerous events, and met mentors. I have a pretty good business now because of a person that I have met in this game. I am sure that this game has made me more confident, more assertive, and more willing to give something a go. I know what it is like to win in this game, and once you learn how to win, you can win in life. That is why I coach, because you have to give back. Especially when it gives you so much. I do not want to see this sport deprived of the vehicle that helps the kids become better and aspire for more, and tournament bowling is that.

I am not going to comment further on this matter, I feel that what I had to say has been said. I am not going to answer whinges, I would love to see solutions and ideas put forth. Roy, please let me know when you are going to have your forum, I would like to help with the solution.

Everyone else out there, lets look for what it is going to take to make it work, instead of kicking a horse that has already bolted. The should we/shouldn't we, the doomsdayers, the knockers, the we don't want its, etc. people please look at the big picture.

Regards,
Dennis Rigney

 

[Andrew S.]

One of the factors that could help both Tournament bowlers and Tournaments would be the formation of a specialised player Association with capable player representatives in charge.
A strong Tournament Association would certainly bring about an improvement in the Tournament scene.
It may not happen overnight but membership of a player Association will rapidly gain momentum.
Other sports have recognised this and I think it's time that our Tournament bowlers take some unilateral action of their own.
I'm not saying its purpose would be to dictate, but initially it would send a message to the proprietors - Hey we're here now, we have money to spend and we're serious, don't take us for granted.

 

[Andrew Frawley]

Hi everyone from Kuwait.
Haven't posted for nearly 6 months, but this is a topic close to my heart.

Firstly, guys and gals the NSW Grand Prix youth and Adult series HAD to be stopped. It was only that the previous operators of AMF had put up with a series that was costing their company sometimes more than $2000 to just put on!!. You only had to look at the entry form to see that many of the events were subsidised heavily...youth events sometimes lost $1500 over a weekend......straight charity.

Sorry but that just ain't good business. No independent centre would spend up to $20,000 a year just to hand it to some high average bowlers who expect the world and don't have the decency to say thank you.

George at Manhattan I estimate cost himself nearly $100000 over 5 years putting on his extravaganza....funny why its not on anymore, a few idiot bowlers complained about this and that and George worked out that he can have a very nice holiday instead of putting up with that crap.

I have said it before, but there just are not enough bowlers to run a tournament series charging $170 to enter, or $120 for youth. Nor was it very smart of the previous operators to give every lane in a centre out on a saturday and 16 lanes on a sunday for practically nothing, to satify less than 50 bolwers.

New bowlers need to be found, then assisted by both AMF and existing tournament players to make then stay playing at that level. The last thing a new tournament player needs is some cranky bowler yelling at them that "you should give way to 2 lanes idiot" New cheaper events, even cheaper if you have never played an event before, simplier formats that are beneficial to both centre and bowler, and far better communication between centres not only to stop double booking, but to promote events that are at other centres.

The most ridiculous thing I have every seen in this industry is AMF centres not promoting events that are on at other AMF centres...honestly they must take much of the blame for the demise of tournament playing at all levels. It was totally laughable that even when the Nationals are at an AMF centre, employees of that company would openly tell customers not to play....even if the Nationals centre was just 20 mins down the road....what are they thinking... guess our company does not need the $100 generated just as lineage and cafe sales for that 5 man team. Simple math tells you what AMF could have generated by just getting 10 new teams from each centre in melbourne. I mean they do know the nationals are on at a particular centre a year in advance, finding 50 bowlers over a year is not a big ask.

This same story happened for all levels, city, state championships, all the way down to the no tap sunday tournaments and late night marathons. All could have been bigger, much bigger if the company policy was different. To many managers trying to keep their bonuses..perhaps.

Many Independent centres are to blame as well, but at least they have attempted to communicate better with their state based proprietor groups.
Every centre has thrown away entry forms for events in other centres, I know I owned one for 10 years.

Bowlers I am sure AMF needs time to get the whole tournament scene in order, put together something that is beneficial for both parties. The right man is as the helm, good luck to everyone involved, tournaments both youth and adult for all levels, are an essential part of keeping customers in this game.

Its a great game, and Austalia has some great bowlers, who all started somewhere. So I only suggest one thing, next time you see a new bowler struggling, scratching his head looking like he/she is ready to give up...just ask if they need anything. That bowler has just contributed to the prizefund with little chance of return maybe for years, tournaments need these bowlers....sometimes we all forget that.

All the best everyone.
Andrew



I also know there are plenty of independant centres that run events for very little or no lineage income for the weekend of the event. They should be congratulated,

 

[Resurrection]

Right peoples letrs have a look at some comparisons for social activities,


Golf = $30 for 4 hours of enjoyment
Pool = $10 an hour, 5 games an hour
Tennis = Free at the right public courts for unlimited hours of fun
Footy = $15-20 for 2.5 hrs
Cricket = $20 for 7 hrs
Movies = $13.50 for 2 hrs and a good flick
Swimming = $5 unlimited hrs of fun
TENPIN BOWLING = $23 for 1 hr (3 games) for social off the street bowler
$14.40 for 30 mins (3 games) for league practise bowler

And those cost weren't including food or drink, to me this is highway robbery. At least if I go and play golf i get some exercise to go with it. Bowling Centres are charging upwards of 30 dollars and hr while other sporting or leisure facilities charge less then 5. Lets get real with this.
Bottom line is prices require reduction and service requires improvement.

Matthew Lambrick
Ex-AMF employee and technician

 

[Brunswick Tech]

Rig, I'm not disagreeing the fact that a bigger percentage of the population bowl once or twice a year, I stated the percentage figure was based on people bowling on a regular basis.

Your placing far too much emphasis on the price to the consumer, its a factor but its not an overiding one.
It's a well known business fact that a person will gladly pay $2 for a $1 item if they want it enough! The social bowler simply does not want the game of bowling bad enough, if the social bowler really wanted to bowl on a regular basis cheaper why wouldn't they just join a league and bowl on the cheapest game rate their is, many houses offer even further reduced prices for bowling in 2 leagues not to mention reduced rates for practice, is this not incentive enough.......what figure do you percieve to be an honest game rate for both the centre and the bowler ?

Tell me also Rig, why has Tenpijn bowling also steadily declined in the U.S, their social game rates I believe are somewhere between $2.50 and $3.50, though don't quote me on that.

In the foreseeable future I cannot see game rates falling for league play below the current price !

You say AMF centres failed because of low standards, poor maintenace and high costs.

I've never worked for AMF but I have worked in centres that AMF bought on their spending spree 7-8 years ago and I can only say those centres as far as I'm concerned were of at least equal if not better then their competition in all the catergories you listed, some older AMF centres, I will grant some needed urgent upgrading, I may be wrong but I'm pretty sure AMF were working on upgrading their centres, I don't know so will believe what you say.

I think the general public percieve Tenpin bowling as only a recreation activity, they do not accept the game as a genuine sporting avenue this coupled with my earlier post regarding social disengagement is the crux of the real problem, find the correct answers to that problem will not be easy, many astute people have tried and failed consistently over the past 20 years.

No, I don't charge $10 a social game, not even close, I was just using $10 as an example. At no stage did I say I would be statisfied with 80 games per shift, your putting words into my posts that don't exsist, to put it into simplier terms for you, if I was turning over the same amount of $$$$ per shift and I had the choice, I would much prefer to do it with a lower lineage rather than a high one, for the reasons I stated.
How you treat your staff and what stratgies you employ to motivate these individuals is your own personal choice. From my experiences using fear is a short term solution and lowers productive work.
Richard Branson has an excellent employee incentive program, he states that this staff program directly contributed to his remarkable rise in his diverse worldly business.
Your philosphy regarding staff leads me to believe that you would struggle to attract happy, contented and productive staff. It is possible for the staff to be productive without being busy! I would be happy to see any staff member casually standing around talking to perspective and or current customers so long as the aren't doing a dis-service to another customer, even if it wasn't bowling related though Andrew's post points out the importance of talking about bowling to the novice.

Social interaction between staff and customers is of the upmost importance to any business dealing directly with the public, all people like to be acknowledged, it's human nature, a feel good sensation comes over the individual when they walk into a centre and a staff member greets them by name, they may even know the shoe size and what they like to eat and or drink, it makes a difference if the staff know their customers on a friendly basis, makes for a better atmosphere all round.

Rig, I'm not doubting your passion for the game if not for people like you the industry would have no hope of returning to the sport we both remember. You posses an important attribute, your active, remember it's easier to guide a ship thats moving then one at anchor.

Nice talking to you.
Shawn

 

[Brunswick Tech]

Right peoples letrs have a look at some comparisons for social activities,


Golf = $30 for 4 hours of enjoyment
Pool = $10 an hour, 5 games an hour
Tennis = Free at the right public courts for unlimited hours of fun
Footy = $15-20 for 2.5 hrs
Cricket = $20 for 7 hrs
Movies = $13.50 for 2 hrs and a good flick
Swimming = $5 unlimited hrs of fun
TENPIN BOWLING = $23 for 1 hr (3 games) for social off the street bowler
$14.40 for 30 mins (3 games) for league practise bowler

And those cost weren't including food or drink, to me this is highway robbery. At least if I go and play golf i get some exercise to go with it. Bowling Centres are charging upwards of 30 dollars and hr while other sporting or leisure facilities charge less then 5. Lets get real with this.
Bottom line is prices require reduction and service requires improvement.

Matthew Lambrick
Ex-AMF employee and technician

Mathew its extremely hard to make comparisions, especially when your comparing only the money spent to length of the activity, measured in time, that 4 hours spent on the golf, how much time did you spend walking around doing nothing but talking?
I can easily increase the time it takes to bowl your game and if you really like walking and the exercise I can put you on lane 20 arrange to turn off the ball return and you can retrieve the ball from the back of the machine yourself walking down the aisle beside lane 1. Now your really getting value for money, a minium 400ft walk every time you throw the ball!

Game rates are not an issuse on this subject, tournament bowling relies on drawing sufficent numbers to offset the costs over a wide platform, these bowlers are drawn from league bowlers and league bowling has not the sufficent numbers to sustain itself in the current format.

Mathew why would you publise that your ex- AMF , are you a disgruntled employee trying to prove a point? and if so, what particuliar grudge do you have, I hope its not because of the pay rate after stating that game costs are "highway robbery"

The majority of bowling centres whether they be a corporation or independently owened are barely breaking even, lower games rates will mean the end Tenpin bowling as we know it.

Shawn

 

[Harry Copeland]

Hey Folks,

Really want to bowl???? or just interested in the money.

Have a look at the Twin Tour format put together by Mary Flower. Based on the principle that bowlers love to bowl. No frills tournaments, lower average bowlers against elites. Scratch and handicap divisions, 10 games at about $70 with the chance to win a few bucks back. Seven Tournaments in different centres around the Brisbane/SEQ area throughout the year. Three squads, usually commencing saturday afternoon through to Sunday afternoon. An example of the popularity - the latest numbers for the April event at Aspley is about 140+ nominations and still three weeks to go.

Really want to bowl?? have a look at this format. Excellent value for money

 

[Resurrection]

No shawn I am not speaking as a disgruntled employee at all and I am not making a coment on AMF wages even though they are under A.W.E.. I am speaking as a bowler, I can see both sides of the business as I am educated in business. I have bowled tournaments in the super 6 series and I bowling in an AMF centre even though I live closer to an Independant centre. Before too long there will no need for this new AMF/Bowl Australia revamp of tournament bowling because you won't have the numbers. Just at bowlling tonight the topic was on everybody's mind. Tournament bowlers have seen these promises before and have never had them delivered. Get out there listen to the bowlers, social bowling will not improve the reputation of bowling as a sport but reduce its reputation to a leisure activity which is at the moment. Bowling has so much to offer but gets very little publicity. My point is we have too get out there which as I have said in a previous post outside the square which is what AMF have failed to do time and time again.

Matthew Lambrick

 

[BELMO]

I've been reading how everyone is upset with tournaments being cancelled. I really don't blame a lot of proprietors. Some go to a lot of work to promote tournaments (like the BMW Orange Open) and we get very little responce. To date we have only 40 players and 90% are the same bowlers who come year after year. Where are all the bowlers that complain that there are NO TOURNAMENTS. We are only 3 hour drive from Sydney. (see entry form on web site totalbowling). Come on bowlers support proprietors that really do support bowlers. 90% of your entry fees are returned to you. Sure there may not be the thousands of dollars in prize money but yeh it is a GREAT TOURNAMENT and a great weekend.

Our centre and manager at our Chester Hill bowl also supports bowlers but again we don't get any support from bowlers as evidence on the last youth tournament. Only 20 youth bowlers nominated. Do you blame centres going cosmic bowling. Sometimes I think people bring the problems onto themselves. Support us and we will support you the Bowlers.
Thanks
Aldo Belmonte Proprietor.

 

[Brunswick Tech]

I've been reading how everyone is upset with tournaments being cancelled. I really don't blame a lot of proprietors. Some go to a lot of work to promote tournaments (like the BMW Orange Open) and we get very little responce. To date we have only 40 players and 90% are the same bowlers who come year after year. Where are all the bowlers that complain that there are NO TOURNAMENTS. We are only 3 hour drive from Sydney. (see entry form on web site totalbowling). Come on bowlers support proprietors that really do support bowlers. 90% of your entry fees are returned to you. Sure there may not be the thousands of dollars in prize money but yeh it is a GREAT TOURNAMENT and a great weekend.

Our centre and manager at our Chester Hill bowl also supports bowlers but again we don't get any support from bowlers as evidence on the last youth tournament. Only 20 youth bowlers nominated. Do you blame centres going cosmic bowling. Sometimes I think people bring the problems onto themselves. Support us and we will support you the Bowlers.
Thanks
Aldo Belmonte Proprietor.

Well said Aldo, if we can't get this point across to the bowlers in the not too soon future, league and tournament bowling will be a thing of the past, many proprieters are cutting their losses now, they see no future in league bowling and are concentrating on social bowling soley.

Shawn

 

[DIECAST NUT]

Hi Everyone,

I agree and disagree with some people it is sad thing that the circuit touneys where cancel but that is business.


If you have staff how have pride in there center and great people running the cafe, and good lane condition = a great center a great cafe and good chalenging lane conditon, happy bowlers which will bring in new bowlers = more and bigger leagues and bigger tourniments and player numbers

think AMF need to look at bring the quality of there centres up as I lot off them look shit, and there lane conditions are in some centres are a dump, there were a few tournments canceled last year from lack of interest because bowlers where not got to spend there good money and try to bowl a decent score.So if you spend some money in your centers you will get more people, people like nice moden center not centers which look cheap and taky and equipment not working.

The cost of a game is $8+ which is stupid you could get more people and big groups in the door if charge around the $5 mark, people will buy 3 game then to 2 games and people will think they are getting value form money, they will spend more at the cafe and games machine because they are there longer.

And having business groups deals is a winner everytime I am at my local bowl there is a group of people from one business.And then they ad the cafe sales.

As from food prices I paid in a center $8 for a coke and hotdog I think it is bit over the top, but didn't mine that so much, but when I got it was cold and I was told tuff thats what you get. Now in any cafe or restrauant poor serve = poor profit.


The issue of sponsorship/prize money was raised it had to get in this industry because off the high profile of other sports,are hard to get just ask aldo from orange bowl but he and hes staff bust there asses to get the prize money and put on a awesome tourniment each year,ask anyone who has played in the orange open they will agree.

But we as bowlers can help our centers to get the money need to run tourniments, we all work for a company you have to ask for as little as $100 and if you get 10 companys putting in $100 each that a $1000 towards the the tourniment and most companys wont past a oppertunity for cheap sponsorship and it also creates a good working enviroment in there company, because you happy and they will make there work mates happy.

I think tbal/amf and private owners need to get together to proposals together to give to big companys like the banks, retail companys who we all deal with and try to get a 5 or 10 year sponsorship deals and they can't say we can't afford it because that is bull#### when they make millions and millions of profit each year and they would have the accounts to make a tax dodge somewhere.


So to all bowlers if you don't help the problem then DON'T BITCH about it.

Thats my 2c worth

 

[cruzer]

Hi Guys,
Well i have been reading this post for a while now and i thought i would post my 2 cents worth.
I believe we have way too many tournaments,especially when you combine Youth and Adult tournaments....by this i mean that for the bowler that is chasing points,he or she virtually has to cover the country at least once a month if not more in some cases.
The answer(again in my humble opinion)would be to have a series like the Super 6 but for Youth,incorporating EVERY STATE and TERRITORRY...that is a total of 8.........All sanctioned,and then Not sanction any other tournies.
This way the Tournaments that are sanctioned would generate good numbers of bowlers,and ALL States and Territories would get a youth tournie which would be fair for ALL bowlers Australia wide

Like i said previously this is just my opinion,

Cheers for now

Paul Kanafa.

 

[Ducati 851]

I think thats well said Paul,

But as a rising youth bowler, I really cant afford to travel interstate all the time, the biggest problem with youth tournaments is......

Due to the amount of highly skilled young bowlers in the country, nobody is going to travel interstate unless they think they are going to cash, im finding numbers are getting less and less, and people like me, who need tournament experience, but arent at the level quite yet, to finish top of the ladder in tournaments, so like many, i compete in regional and local adult tournaments,

There must be a way to fix this, but for the moment, Ill just gonna bowl my best in the Brisbane circuit.

 

[craig]

in regards to pauls comment about sanctioning or ranking tournaments, i couldn't agree more

there should be no more than 12 adult and 12 youth tournaments ranked

financially it is too challenging for most

and tournament bowling is about the bottom of the pyramid and not the top

 

[lgt]

There seems to be lots of comments, not whinging, about where bowling is at. The biggest cost in getting to the 'elite' level is the lineage, practise rates and league on the weekly basis. The coach says you should bowl 20 prac games a week, the best your home centre will do is $4, one league and some tournaments, goodbye $120 and up per week. There will be no sport if there is no support at entry levels.
Rank only the select tounaments but encourage cheaper, regional tournaments for up and coming bowlers to get experience, for all age groups. Try and get the centres to at least recognise the achievements of all bowlers. The independent centres, in my experience, are getting it togehter and can only keep it up if supported by bowlers.
Yes its all about $, for all involved, but what isn't...

 

[CV]

After following this post for a few days, I feel that too much has been focused on the monetary side of things which is causing people to stray away from the reason why I and most other people bowl :- FOR THE LOVE OF THE SPORT!!

I love tenpin bowling, I try and make an appearance at all the tournaments in the brisbane area but being a poor assed uni student, high tournament prices can be a problem when trying to find a balance of living day to day and participating in the sport I love.

I am all for a resurrection in tournament bowling, but I feel that some people are being too driven by how much prizemoney is on offer instead of bowling for pride & achievement.
It does feel good to make a bit of money in a tourney but my opinion is that the only way to save tournament bowling is to start at the bottom, and work our way forward.

One way may be to offer a cheaper form of tourament bowling, very similar to the wonderful format that Mary Flower has in the twin tour series here in Brisbane then once we start getting the numbers to tournaments, offer the bigger prizemoney tourneys.

Before we can get the bigger tourneys up and running profitably again, we need to build up a larger tournament bowling base, that is, encourage the 160-190 average bowlers to bowl in these smaller tourneys and get some experience so that they may eventually tackle a bigger tourney when they become more experienced. This may also make the whole scene more competitive, something I would really like to see as I welcome more competition.

But you cannot blame some proprietors for not wanting to run tourneys if they aren't going to recouperate their costs. After all, most of these guys are just like you and I, at the end of the day, they have families to feed too.

I hope with some of the productive suggestions that some of the posters have put forward, that we can save tournament bowling in Australia.

That my 2 cents.

Peace all.

Chris Valentine.

 

[RobbieB]

With the Twin tour going so well, and :shock: 136 :shock: entries in the K&K so far, the solution to saving tournament bowling everywhere else in Oz would seem to be to clone Mary and send one of each of her to the other states. :lol:

Again it comes down to $$$. Mary provides a great deal with the Twin Tour, and everyone has a great time, whether they cash or not. At $70 it is affordable even if people don't cash often, and the flow-on to scratch tournaments will happen as people get better and more competitive. The TT provides a level playing field for everyone, and acts as a 'halfway house" also for those who are not yet up to scratch, but looking for a competitive tournament. AFAIK, Qld is the only State with this type of circuit, and the scratch tounament scene appears to be recovering here fairly rapidly. I don't think that is a coincidence.

 

[cruzer]

RobbieB wrote..

With the Twin tour going so well, and 136 entries in the K&K so far, the solution to saving tournament bowling everywhere else in Oz would seem to be to clone Mary and send one of each of her to the other states.

Again it comes down to $$$. Mary provides a great deal with the Twin Tour, and everyone has a great time, whether they cash or not. At $70 it is affordable even if people don't cash often, and the flow-on to scratch tournaments will happen as people get better and more competitive. The TT provides a level playing field for everyone, and acts as a 'halfway house" also for those who are not yet up to scratch, but looking for a competitive tournament. AFAIK, Qld is the only State with this type of circuit, and the scratch tounament scene appears to be recovering here fairly rapidly. I don't think that is a coincidence.
_________________
Rob Buckley.

What you have forgotten Rob is the Largest expense...AIRFARES...
Example..Adelaide to Darwin return(two months ago)$560....Adelaide to Sydney return $368...cheapest...Adelaide to Brisbane return $218...Adelaide to Canberra return $230...So you get the picture,it costs plenty just to travel let alone entry fees,accomodation,food,etc etc.
So back to my original post,in my opinion way too many tournemants.Sanction 8 Youth events(one in each state and territorry)and all other events are not sanctioned.
But this should also be a benefit to smaller tournemants in individual states because they can still hold there tournies and have smaller payouts and i am sure that the local bowlers Will support these events.
There doesn't need to be $2000 or $1500 first prize for local bowlers to attend a tournie,in my opinion $600-$700 first prize is ample,and let the payout be longer.So what your creating is a local comp for local bowlers(eg..N.S.W...VIC...QLD...Huge talent pools) and the bowlers achieve experience,FUN,and Good competition without the extra expense of travel.

Just my thoughts guys,

Cheers for now

Paul Kanafa