Stroker Vs Cranker

[Macka69]

I found George's advice very good as I have only been bowling for 14 month's.
I'm a stroker but i do like to watch the crankers but it must play on their wrist's later in life.
I've bowled in two tournement's the Emerson Shield and Country Cup and as the lane conditions deteriated the crankers were being left with more splits than the strokers but as George stated do what feel's natural. Lyndon

 

[Bowlers Emporium]

Here we are after 20 years still debating which is best!!

Ive heard Strokers say "Crankers are ****ers!"
In reply Crankers have said "Strokers are Jokers!"

I am a Stroker and proud of it!!
I used to be a Cranker and am not ashamed of it.

Age and ball technology (mainly age) is why I prefer to stroke rather than crank!

With current oil patterns, depending on where you bowl, one style is always going to out perform the other on occasions.

At the end of the day it comes down to personal choice.
If a Cranker you want to be, then Crank you will!
If a Stroker you want to be, then Stroke you will!

The biggest winner in this debate is our beloved sport of Ten Pin Bowling!

So get out there and Crank or Stroke to your hearts content!
Remember "If you aint havin fun.. It aint worth doin!!"

May the FORCE be with you

 

[jimcross]

Good Subject, even if It's 20 years old. Wonder if there's any top bowlers out there [who will admit it] like Fred Couples in golf. Probably about 15 years ago, I read about him at a speaking engagement, when he was asked a question about the golf swing,to which he replied " I know diddly-squat about the golf swing - I just hit the ball."
Anybody admit to just being a 'natural?'

 

[Jez]

just read below i accidentally posted twice

 

[Jez]

I think when u look at the guys that are winning around the world they are a combination of both...some call them Tweeners but i prefer the term "Power Players". They have the rotation of the crankers yet the easy swings of and some attributes of strokers.

Guys like Walshy and Qualla and the younger guys like Loader and Zentfeld and good examples.. they are a mix of both. I dont consider myself as a stroker or a cranker. But for ppl that have known me from my Junior days when i used a mongoose and didnt move the ball much, i knew i had to change to compete with the top guys and i worked very hard at my game (all praise to Doc Kee) and i got my revs up to a where i can compete and still be accurate.

Of course there are going to be exceptions to this like Belmo who is incredible at what he does and i think in 10-15 years the questions may not be Stroker v cranker it will prob be "One v Two Hands!"

George is another exception, he is ur text book stroker who is great at what he does, he has got his shot to a point which best suits him and has made him a great bowler and a successful one, however he will also tell u if he was right handed he would need to modify this shot a little to compete.

As said by other this conversion could be talked about forever...main thing is too find the happy medium that suits ur game.

 

[SCOOPS]

WHERE ARE THE SPINNERS

WHERE DO THE SPINNERS FALL IN?

lol

 

[jason_doust]

Lots of good discussion here. George has submitted a thoughtful response, indicative of the work he has put in. There is just one problem with it and I reply in the spirit of fair criticism and with due respect.

Reactive gear strips the heads about 8 times faster on the right because there's about 8 times the players, (usually shooting about 80 different lines in our great nation.) Therefore to be successful on the right hand side these days, you need to be able to play inside the 5th arrow pretty regularly. This requires the ability to blow the 5 pin while looking at it from the wrong side. It's not that often you need to do that on the left, so the stroking style is an obvious path to success over there. (You lucky buggers!)

To play that deep without rolling out is a tall ask for a stroker and impossible for a fudger. As righties need to use the LHS heads more and more often (especially as our ageing synthetic surfaces track up from destructo-balls) that must mean that righties will need some additional grunt to remain competitive. Strangely, this doesn't mean we'll need to be crankers. Just able to knock down 10 from deep, deep inside to win national tournaments.

 

[wchester]

Therefore to be successful on the right hand side these days, you need to be able to play inside the 5th arrow pretty regularly. This requires the ability to blow the 5 pin while looking at it from the wrong side.
To play that deep without rolling out is a tall ask for a stroker and impossible for a fudger. .......righties will need some additional grunt to remain competitive. Strangely, this doesn't mean we'll need to be crankers. Just able to knock down 10 from deep, deep inside to win national tournaments.

I didn't realise Paul Trotter got in that deep.....
or was your post just one more backhanded stab at the left handed bowler.
There have been a couple others in this thread, from two of our top bowlers, Jason Belmonte and Jarrod Lean. I guess it will never end..Maybe you guys should just ban bowlers from playing left-handed, like they do in Jai Alai. But if that were to happen then what will you blame your losses on?

 

[Jase]

Wayne,

I am sorry but I will disagree with you there, Jarrod and Belmo couldn’t be any closer mates to George than anyone on this forum, so to think they are taking the piss out of him, is so far from the truth it isn’t funny. As for Doust'y I have met him personally thanks to Terry Wenban and you also couldn't meet a nicer bloke. I think you have read there post all wrong, or looking to stir things up one or the other.

Sorry to take it off topic guys just had to clear that up!

 

[wchester]

No Jase..I don't believe I made any mistake there.

I've been close friends with some of the best righthanded bowlers in the world, but that didn't prevent them from being anti-lefty when it came to bowling. I wasn't accusing them of singling out George either..just left handers in general.

In fact I like Belmo a lot and Jarrod is a hell of a bowler, I only wish they could see beyond their own prejudices.

I guess you'd have to be on the other end for a couple of decades before you really understood the guises under which the disparaging remarks are sometimes made.

 

[wchester]

Q.Why don't the righthanders play the outside line just like the lefties?

A.Because the lanes don't let them. The same reason why lefties
don't play 5th arrow.

 

[jason_doust]

No Jase..I don't believe I made any mistake there.
I've been close friends with some of the best righthanded bowlers in the world, but that didn't prevent them from being anti-lefty when it came to bowling. I wasn't accusing them of singling out George either..just left handers in general.
In fact I like Belmo a lot and Jarrod is a hell of a bowler, I only wish they could see beyond their own prejudices.
I guess you'd have to be on the other end for a couple of decades before you really understood the guises under which the disparaging remarks are sometimes made.

Probably not a mistake so much as a misinterpretation of what I am saying. You're right Wayne, lefties cop a lot of unwarranted crap from people with a little bit of knowledge. I remember one SPC where folks claimed it was a left handed ditch, because lefties were running something like 1,2,3 & 5. The fact that the top average was 206 wouldn't deter the knockers. It's just that the right was uglier.

The worst place in the world to bowl the LHS used to be the PBA. It was out of bounds most of the year. Any wonder when they opened it up, the lefties ate it! They were damned ready! But that was a quite deliberate effort (misguided or not) to "even things up". I honestly don't know if that's still the case. I make no judgement on that issue. The fact is that the LHS has a better surface and surface trumps oil for predictability, so lefties get to play a little smoother. Good for them, yes, I'm jealous of this fact!

I've never met anyone who wanted to play 5th arrow. It's just necessary sometimes. All I am saying is that on the RHS, it's more necessary because of traffic, so a couple of extra revs comes in handy there. That's it. I'm just trying to add some right handed perspective to George's otherwise comprehensive take on things. I love to see good players. I really don't give a tinkers cuss what hand (or both hands!) they bowl with.

 

[mr_change]

I think anyone who can bowl as a stroker and still put a decent amount of revs into the ball can get just as good carry. I am a self taught cranker who has a messy setup and style. I been changing to a power stroker and have found that I am getting just as much carry.

 

[SCOOPS]

Jason my goodness you always had to stand that far left when u bowled it that slow

And since when did u care about anyone especially lefties

I love seeing you in here buddy, we never did catch up for that drink

But it was fun to watching carve racks at Tuggers with Urethane

When u gonna get serious and start dialling it up again, we need someone back on the lanes with SHADES ON

Strokers, Crankers, tweeners, full rollers, or us old spinners, the object of the game is knock over 10pins in a frame (pref with 1st ball only) as many times as you and as consistently as you can.

The current issue of AMF's rag, has one of our all time best players/performers
Some people may think that i'm being biassed towards my fellow FUBARIAN, Tom Kury, but i looked up to Tom as a kid before he returned to Perth, where we became good friends (except during cards hey Tom... lol)

I dont know how many Crankers today yesterday or tomorrow who will live up to some of his feats let alone his longjevity in the game, as he said he's still averaging 200+ now from what i can recall that would be for over 25years or close....

I hear someone say Belmo, and quite correct he has more than enough ability and opportunites to match and even surpass but thats only 1 in the last how many years??????????

I know what ur all saying and i agree however if only 10% of our youth/juniors across the country improved their spare shooting by 50% perhaps there may be a few more pushing one of greatest stats

Agree get that big dial up shot happening but get the whole game

STRIKES fo SHOW, SPARES for DOUGH

 

[BELMO]

There have been a couple others in this thread, from two of our top bowlers, Jason Belmonte and Jarrod Lean. I guess it will never end..Maybe you guys should just ban bowlers from playing left-handed, like they do in Jai Alai.

Only a lefty would say something like that!

I stand by my comments!

Belmo

 

[Jez]

Wayne,

Once again i think you are just trying to "stir the pot"(seems to be the termed used) on this site once again...everyone that knows me knows that i have the utmost respect for George and think he is a great bowler. Jase thanks for your post clearing that up.

I simply said in my post and stated George has the same opinion, that if he was right handed he would need to modify his game..The guy is not righted handed so he can go on doing what he does. The same goes the other way..if i was left handed my shot would be different.

So i take nothing back from my original post and i have spoken to George and he wasn't upset at all about the comments i made.

Think you are just a little too defensive about the the whole left handed v right handed issue. Relax and smile a little not everything on here is a dig at someone

 

[SCOOPS]

George gives as good as he gets, as we all do or have done

 

[Grant61]

As said earlier, this topic has been around really since the early 70's and has always created a great debate. In the late 80's I was lucky enough to spend a month with the late great Don Johnson learning coaching techinques.
And for those young ones who do not know him..he was one of the greats of the PBA Tour and in late years the Pro's coach and mentor! He was a firm believer in working with what you already had, and develop a game that best suits YOU...hence I agree with George in this respect.
He said, every bowler has good and bad points and trying to copy another bowlers game could simply mean you are copying bad techincial mistakes.The best style a bowler could work too was not a cranker or a stroker..but what he called a CROKER..and combination of strokers timing and a crankers carry!...The ulitmate game...and balance of Power and Control.
We have alot of great players in Australia, but in real terms, only a couple who are actually "Crankers" as opposed to alot of great bowlers who are "Wrist players" and what I would call Crokers!
There is one particular quote he wanted everyone to all remember....
"It's not the amount of lift you have, it's the amount of wrist you have" If you can control your wrist, you can control the lanes!
Back in the 80's, Don had a clear vision for the next 20 years on who would be the worlds greatest bowlers..The ones with great timing and great wrist. These are the bowlers who will make a living on tour, cash regularly and WIN!
So now some 20 years on, lets look at the all time greats of our sport
All-Time Denny's PBA Tour Titlists
Updated after: 2006 Dexter Tournament of Champions (9/4/06)
41 Titles
Earl Anthony
Walter Ray Williams Jr.
34 Titles
Mark Roth
32 Titles
Pete Weber
30 Titles
Parker Bohn III
27 Titles
Mike Aulby
26 Titles
Don Johnson
D.Weber
24 Titles
Brian Voss
23 Titles
Norm Duke
22 Titles
Marshall Holman
20 Titles
D.Ritger
Wayne Webb
Judging by the list, I think he was right!

 

[jason_doust]

Jason my goodness you always had to stand that far left when u bowled it that slow
And since when did u care about anyone especially lefties

Scoops, I care about everyone. Until I play 'em of course! And straight after, I care again! We will have that drink one day. I'm so slack like that! Sorry mate.
As for slow, it's pretty tricky getting speed on 20 feet of oil with hit-up rotation! I spend a lot of time playing soft these days... ;-)

 

[wchester]

Jez..

I'm not defensive about it. I've been hearing it for the last 37 years. What I'm really saying is that the right handed players who think lefties aren't worthy of carrying their bag, are just plain blind...... maybe it's the brightness of their own high opinion of themselves.

Learn to co-exist boys and you'll be a man because of it.