Tournament nominations

[Casual Observer]

There have been a number of tourneys where people nominate then withdraw and in fact it is an ongoing issue. It stuffs up prize funds, affects sponsors (if tourney has them) affects squads and so on.

Why can't the following occur?

Nominations are only received with a non-refundable deposit that covers the prize fund portion of the entry fee. Once your nomination and deposit are received only then do you get to choose a squad. If you withdraw then the deposit is not refunded and the withdrawal does not affect the tourney prize fund. This would not only get deposits in early and secure prize money but it would stop people who have no idea if they are available or not from nominating for a squad just to try and secure a place in that squad in case they can make it. I know people are going to say that doesn't happen but it does.

Or, do we just leave it as is and have another system that doesn't work?

 

[Schmicko]

I think when most people nominate for a tournament, they have full intentions of attending, however, circumstances change and people sometimes have to pull out. And generally there are reserves to cover any vacancies.
If you enforce a mandatory deposit, people may wait until just weeks before a tournament to nominate.. Or not at all.
If I was a sponsor, I wouldn't be too excited to see half filled squads 3 weeks away from the event.
The more interest shown by bowlers at the beginning, entices more bowlers to be at the tournament, also, it gives u a better idea on prize fund.
Would you pay a seasons worth of prize money to your weekly league treasurer incase u pull out mid season because circumstances changed? Just so the prizefund doesn't change too much?

 

[Roysa]

I agree with Smicko.

Some people have work commitments that unfortunately require people to be flexible. If these people lost their deposit even once they wouldn't be inclined to nominate for future tourneys.

If the issue was that people are missing out on bowling due to drop outs from full squads then that's not ideal but if the issue is mainly reduced prize funds then the question has to be asks is it really a big enough issue to call for mandatory deposits.

 

[Casual Observer]

There are a number of issues, one of them being prize funds.

Even if the deposit became non-refundable a month out from the tourney or something would be better than it is now.

There is always a certain squad people all seem to want to bowl. It fills up in no time yet by the time tourneys come around a number of those people don't bowl. Squad choice should only be allowed once the deposit is paid. Fair on all. Let me put it another way. How many people don't go to tourneys because they can't get in the squad(s) they want?

Centres cater etc for these tourneys. Other arrangements are made based on entries.

There current system obviously doesn't work as it allows this to happen.

 

[JIMBOB]

I would believe it is up to the individual tournament to decide to do this. The tournament entry form can stipulate this as a requirement if they want to & I believe some do. On a side note I do feel sorry what has happened to Deano with all the late withdraws at Mildura. I'm sure it will be a goody though and hopefully won't deter him doing it all again next year.

 

[magpi17]

I am a bowler that this thread attributes to, I absolutely look forward to bowling tournaments and as such place my name in as soon as I can. BUT my position with my company does not allow me the luxury of a magic ball and as such there are times I am called out that require me no give, it may be to investigate an incident or conduct a breath test or just cover for a colleague that rings in sick at any ungodly hour. I do attempt to give as much notice as possible but nothing is more disappointing as having things packed and planned then getting that call.
On another tone I normally nominate in early squads and I am yet to bowl in a full squad!!
The thing I have found out in many circles is the lack of consideration for the shift worker, I have done shift work for 34 years, not the normal 8 hour shift but the anytime of the day for up to 12 hour type.

 

[mickyd213]

I am a bowler that this thread attributes to, I absolutely look forward to bowling tournaments and as such place my name in as soon as I can.

I don't think you're alone there Neil... I think that most bowlers would make every effort to make it if they put their names in but situations change which might or can't be controlled...

The thing I have found out in many circles is the lack of consideration for the shift worker, I have done shift work for 34 years, not the normal 8 hour shift but the anytime of the day for up to 12 hour type.

I'm in the same boat... 12hr rotating shift. We can't run short staffed as we are a major hazard facility and as such are pretty much on call 24/7. Sometimes we know in advance that cover is required but 90% of the time we are called and given less than an hours notice.

 

[CHIN]

I used to work afternoon/night shift every weekend for nearly 10 years. If I wanted a weekend off to go away bowling I woulud organize time off or someone to cover my shifts 2-3 months in advance so I could organize reasonable airfares and only then enter the Tournament. Wasnt that hard to do.

If your a definite starter wheres the problem paying a deposit to secure your spot. If you know you may have a problem getting time of work put your name down and take your chances of getting bumped to another squad if all the other bowlers in squad have secured there spot by paying there deposit.

When the last time there has been a totally full tournament with reserves waiting that didnt get a run, 199?. Senior tournament excluded.

 

[magpi17]

mickyd213
Yeah shift works a b, I'm a freight train driver but I'm also the depot trainer/manager so when it goes pear shaped I'm it.
It makes even the weekly leagues hard.

 

[magpi17]

This is fine on a rotating shift, I do not know what my shifts are until the middle of my second weekly cycle. If I had a rotating shift I wouldn't miss a single tournament or sports series but I can sign on anywhere between midnight and midnight and have a 8 to 12 hour shift, in my game there are no certainties but if I wait to put my name down late there's accomodation to book and travel to organize. in my position I am the last resort so if someone puts in for leave then I work.
Oh for the simple life!

I used to work afternoon/night shift every weekend for nearly 10 years. If I wanted a weekend off to go away bowling I woulud organize time off or someone to cover my shifts 2-3 months in advance so I could organize reasonable airfares and only then enter the Tournament. Wasnt that hard to do.

If your a definite starter wheres the problem paying a deposit to secure your spot. If you know you may have a problem getting time of work put your name down and take your chances of getting bumped to another squad if all the other bowlers in squad have secured there spot by paying there deposit.

When the last time there has been a totally full tournament with reserves waiting that didnt get a run, 199?. Senior tournament excluded.

 

[CHIN]

catch 22...if you enter early, pay deposit for accomadation & organize airfares etc then pull out a week before tournament. loss more money.

 

[magpi17]

Yep, or lose another tournament player or 2.
Shouldn't need a note like a naughty little boy if you need to pull out for a genuine reason!
I do understand the logics of the post but please consider the shift workers.

 

[Casual Observer]

It is not one or two shift workers and like Chin said, organise it early and it shouldn't be an issue.

It is a heap of bowlers and it is most tourneys. Genuine reasons do exist but the number of people doing it means that not all are genuine. More than half would just be a case of deciding they don't want to bowl it so they pull out.

Time and time again people ask what we need to fix. Well recognising the issues is a good place to start and people just pulling out of tourneys is one of them..

 

[Roysa]

I still dont believe in punishing those who do the right thing by enforcing non refundable deposits. People who genueinly have to pull out for reasons such as Neil and others have noted should not be punished.

Maybe those 'heap of bowlers' at 'most tourneys' need to be given a formal warning in regards to their conduct. Seems to me the answer is to be all grown up about the issue, if there are repeat offenders then reprimand them. Is this something the tournament director should enforce?

 

[dishman]

If there is squad that is full but some haven't paid a deposit, then the reserves should be able to pay a deposit to secure a spot in the squad

 

[Roysa]

I dont disagree with paying a deposit to 100% secure a spot in a squad, but i do disagree with a blanket rule that says all nominations must be accompanied by a non refundable deposit, this will do just as much harm to the total entries as the drop out rate.

 

[Schmicko]

CO... Really? Why even start the thread... This coming from a guy that won't even support his home centres tourny.. Grow up mate, and get off the soap box

Ppl sometimes can't attend a tourny.. Its been this way for a long, long time.. Deal with it

 

[Roysa]

It is not one or two shift workers and like Chin said, organise it early and it shouldn't be an issue..

Thats the point, people cant always organise it early, and im sure most dont go out of their way to pull out deliberatly to spite someone.

Anyone here missed a flight and as a result missed their squad? George? Micheal? Sam?

Blanket rule would see these people lose their deposits, bit unfair IMO.

 

[lgt]

Tournament management point of view

I currently find 7% drop out on day, 25% of those have paid a deposit - and most don't ring to withdraw

I return deposit for bowlers who have to withdraw and give notice

I base payout on realistic entries, this might not make the payout look 'fantastic' but better to have changes go upward

I love to see a bowl full of bowlers enjoying the competition - just needs a little cooperation between all involved - you know that old word called courtesy

Leanne

 

[grimmace_25]

CO... Really? Why even start the thread... This coming from a guy that won't even support his home centres tourny.. Grow up mate, and get off the soap box

Ppl sometimes can't attend a tourny.. Its been this way for a long, long time.. Deal with it

This mentality and comment is completely uncalled for. You're either ignorant of the issue at hand or attempting to troll Gary into a negative post. Not supporting his home tournament? Very uninformed thing to say. Just because he knows his limits in terms of tournament bowling, doesn't mean there's no support. Has he organized sponsorship, put proposals to council, organized Thursdays BBQ, is he TD ffs? You have no idea, so get off your soap box.

Not very often I agree with Gary but I think given he was the OP people immediately take the opposite stance without reading or looking into the issue at hand.

It's an interesting point that deserves some constructive debate, not the usual 'stfu CO, get a life' crap. Try organizing a big tournament with over 100 people and 15,000 in sponsorship and then get some perspective.