Fairness of Leagues

[CHIN]

Never accussed any techs of being cheats pockets. That was your interpretation. Maybe as a tech that is something you know more about than the rest of us.
All I said was what was to stop a tech from laying a pattern better suited to his game than others in the league. He might be the only lefty in the league.

And dont all the lefties get your knickers in a knot thinking im calling all of them cheats. Bowlers are paranoid enough.


The staff member I referred to in my 1st post worked behind the front counter. Never mentioned he was back end staff.

 

[pockets72]

did'nt mean to offend you chin i personally think that it could happen i also know of centres that change conditons 2 suit certain bowlers and the decision is mad by management i would'nt be happy if i bowled a 300 and i set up the condition 2 suit myself what satisfaction do you get out of that

 

[CHIN]

DONT GET OFFENDED. BEEN BOWLING TO LONG.

 

[strop]

What are you trying to say Robert, As a old Tech I use to lay my own patterns down?

cheers

Tony

 

[JWhitty]

Just looking up a rule on an unrelated note and spotted this one which directly (and difinitively?) should close this issue;

RULE 123 PRIZES - PROPRIETORS AND THEIR EMPLOYEES
No tournaments or leagues can restrict the owner of the bowling establishment or his employees from qualifying for individual or all events prizes.

 

[RHs_rule300]

way to go whitty.. in the end, everyone has to bowl on the same condition anyway

 

[Milena]

atleast someone mentioned the rule book, if not i was going to

 

[jemmo]

i dont see a problem with staff bowling in the centre they work in. and regardless if ur the head tech or not u still have to bowl the ball down the lane and carry the 7 or 10 pin and what about the people who work for the bowling ball companys they would be pretty pissed if they cant use the product that they make wouldnt they?

 

[Troyza]

lol I keep hearing this "whats to stop a tech laying down a pattern to suit him self" comment.

Well, it's not that hard to tell if a pattern has been changed. Being a jr tech my self (& having access to a wick & shim machine) 'rigging' the lane would be too hard because it only takes the 'smallest' adjustment to make a huge difference out on the lane.

I think people need to stop being paranoid, though.

 

[CHIN]

I agree. Would be harder for a tech to take advantage or set up the lanes to suit himself as everyone has to bowl on them. Set em up for himself, set em up for everyone.
As I said before, what I had a problem with was the front end staff putting in bogus scores so they could win the $1,000 first prize.

 

[Troyza]

Ah yes. But isn't this why we have scoring verification by having each bowler sign each others scores whilst bowling that particular block? It's the same deal for leagues, for our super league we write down our scores, & the captain of each team signs the score card, which is then kept for record by both the bowling center, & the treasurer. If anomalies appear, ultimately what is on the score card counts, because each captain has verified its legitimacy. if the scores are wrong on the card, it's the captains fault for not picking up on it.

Then again, there probably are people who try to do what you've suggested, & shame on them.

 

[CHIN]

As I said previously in this thread.

The incident I reffered to was a phantom league over the Christmas break run by several centres.
8 or 10 weeks long.
$1,000 first prize.
Each bowler could bowl there 3 games anytime during that week.
"Turn up by yourself bowl 3 games & walk out".
Only person to verify the scores was centre staff.
Hence 1 of the centre staff was the person caught cheating.
These leagues were run in several centres in Adelaide & I would imagine several other centres around Australia.
I doubt it was restricted to Adelaide.

 

[Troyza]

Hmm interesting. Wouldn't that be illegal in terms of league rules? I mean going in, bowling, & leaving with only center staff to verify? Sounds stupid.

We had a phantom league, & our center manager was in it with his wife. However, the scores were saved into the computer, & were available for review when requested.

 

[tenpinyo]

Hmm interesting. Wouldn't that be illegal in terms of league rules? I mean going in, bowling, & leaving with only center staff to verify? Sounds stupid.

We had a phantom league, & our center manager was in it with his wife. However, the scores were saved into the computer, & were available for review when requested.

most systems that are used by centres have the ability to save scores yes...but remember that these scores can be adjusted and changed at any time

 

[blue63]

bowling in the centre you work in is very hard at the best of of times .because most of the time instead of the bowlers going up to the staff members that are actually working the shift they go the staff member who is bowling at the time with there problems and it is really hard to keep focus on your game. So i reckon its fine for AMF employees to bowl in the centre they work in

 

[CHIN]

bowling in the centre you work in is very hard at the best of of times .because most of the time instead of the bowlers going up to the staff members that are actually working the shift they go the staff member who is bowling at the time with there problems and it is really hard to keep focus on your game. So i reckon its fine for AMF employees to bowl in the centre they work in

Perfect example why I would prefer to bowl in another centre.

 

[Troyza]

I bowl in our centers super league on wednesday nights, & I'm often called by other bowlers to go & fix their problems. I think its great practice for my mental game. It used to annoy me at first, but i decided to look at it in positive light instead of getting annoyed about it.

 

[jason_doust]

lol I keep hearing this "whats to stop a tech laying down a pattern to suit him self" comment.

Well, it's not that hard to tell if a pattern has been changed. Being a jr tech my self (& having access to a wick & shim machine) 'rigging' the lane would be too hard because it only takes the 'smallest' adjustment to make a huge difference out on the lane.

I think people need to stop being paranoid, though.

Good point. So taking that into account, (playing devil's advocate here) what if a tech did make a radical change to the condition? What if they suddenly averaged 230 and they weren't putting in any additional practice?

I can't think of many times this has happened, which is testimony to the integrity of so many techs out there, but it has, and it will, and not everyone's accepting of it or fooled by it when it happens. Of course employees should be allowed to compete, but people can do the strangest things for money or just glory. We should remain vigilant, but keep from being suspicious until sufficiently provoked. Every tech who can bowl will lay down a pattern they think is good (which means they probably like it) and then balance that with feedback from the customer base. The key word is balance and it's a difficult trick to pull off. Some techs have selective hearing. If someone says "dry lane" they hear "no more out of ranges" whereas others hear "lane damage."

As for the Coke analogy. It doesn't quite fit. Again playing devil's advocate. Would a cricket greenkeeper who happens to be a spin bowler set up a dry, flat cricket pitch that suited pacers? Maybe. But what if this person were suddenly unbeatable on their suddenly slow damp pitch that was turning a foot more? What if some of the best batsmen in the land were no match for them on this home advantage of their own making? Likewise if they were a pacer and made pitch chip dry and flat and fast so that spin became ineffective?

It'd stink, wouldn't it..? It would be unethical, lack integrity and could be called cheating. It would show a disappointing lack of customer service or even character.

No bowler can adapt to all conditions. That's the real truth. That's why the balance is so important. When the balance is tipped too far in particular direction, the people at the other end are being treated unfairly.

 

[Nebster]

Knowing Troy as i do Jason, i can certainly say he would NOT do something like that, as he lays down the pattern he is told to. Before you shoot me down and say "There are other techs out there that might", i'll say i agree. There are SOME out there that are complete tight asses who want a few seconds in the limelight, but they can be picked out when they all of a sudden choke when they leave their home centre.
As for them all of a sudden bowling a 230 average without practice, it seems a bit extreme that someone;s average could do that given the circumstances. BUT, if they could do that, who's to say that only their average would increase??? If they could do that, surely everyone else who bowls at that centre would notice an increase in their average as well.

 

[Troyza]

No no, I agree with you Jason, there are definitely going to be people out there capable of rigging a machine for their own benefit. I just don't think it's as common as other people suggest. Selective hearing is good terminology for it.