2010 Australian Adult team announced

Geoff....

Maybe you need to learn some things about the TBA before you state that I possibly am throwing stones rather than offering suggestions of help or should try and get on a board...

If you actually knew what the TBA has done to my family in the last few years then you would know why I am so negative towards them.

And please tell me that I read your last post wrong and you weren't actually stating that Belmo doesn't offer himself to Australian teams/hasn't done anything for this country???????????????? Man..... all I can say is WOW.... Let's just hope that I misread your comment.

Michelle

Yes you did misread my comment

I didnt say YOU were throwing stones but some do and the point
I am making is we can all do that, Me too for that matter over
2 issues that made me most unhappy, I can tell you

However It is time, In my view, that we try to fix things, thats all

I am sorry things went bad for you with the TBA, Not sure if
we can help in anyway to resolve issues for you

We can but try

Cheers
Geoff
 
ok now...Lets before this really gets out of hand remember what this thread was about...Lets not get too off track and yes it had turned into some healthy discussions regarding the Team...

Now also lets not start singling out people as to why they haven't made them selves available...EVERYONE would have different reasons as to why...

I do say this though and this is no way a Dig at the Australian Coach or his assistants...This is MY OPINION and MINE only...

Lets just say

Belmo...Walsh...Bottomley...Little...Qualla...Frilingos...Pilkington...Lean...Frawls, just to name a few all made themselves available...Most, and i wont say all, but most of them are at a level that a coach may no longer be able to help them...They just need more of a manager...Or if they are going to fund a coach then fund the Team as well...

So that being said, perhaps the fact that the Coach is funded for these trips and They have to fund their own way is the very fact we cannot get these people to go away and make themselves available...Lets face it, most of them still travel and Some overseas at different times of the year...So why should the coach be funded/paid and the players not...There i just said what alot of people are thinking or too afraid to say it...

And until that changes no one is aloud to Judge these people for not putting their hand up to make themselves available for the Australian Team...

Look at the Names mentioned above (and yes i have probably left some out) that would then be an Australian Dream Team for sure...

Jase

All very good points and what i was also saying

I understand why some of them dont go, Its very expensive
to travel and you should be funded to represent your Country
And I am not for 1 second putting anyone down for not putting
their hand up to go

This is not backyard Cricket

On the coaching issue, I beg to differ
Even Roger Federer still has a coach

Cheers
Geoff
 
Its going to be a long post, so im sorry in advance.


Geoff,
I'll just assume you were drunk when you wrote that and didn't mean that - But i will defend my Australian Team commitments and my commitments for advertising the game in Australia and around the world.

Why I'm not bowling for Australia - The answer you want so badly -

Its a question I have been emailed, asked and called about from bowling writers all over the world for the past 3 months!
Ill tell you the same thing I told them - the truth as to why im not bowling.

I have bowled for my country since 2001 - youth and adult teams. Many of those years, i was bowling in both teams during the same year.
I have spent close to $30,000 (give or take) bowling for my country during during the past decade.
I commend and respect each player that has earned their way on to these teams. I know the sacrifices that has to be made to bowl for our country and i also know, too well, the expense that follows with it.
EVERYONE on these teams (Schools, Youth, Men and Women, Seniors, disabled) you are deserving of your spot no matter what is said or written.
Remember that, when you double in the 10th to win a medal for the first time - I DID!

This trip (with my experience as a traveller and with traveling with an Australian team) to Germany will cost more than I can afford to spend with no possible return.
I love bowling for Australia and the close to 30 medals (of all colours) ive won for our country mean so much to me. It breaks my heart not to be shoeing up for these FIQ teams, but its a choice I had to make.

Every time i bowl anywhere in the world - Im representing Australia (doesnt have to be just at FIQ's) and Australian Bowling. I do it with pride and I make it known that I am Australian and that I am in an Australian TEAM Member. I even have Australia written on my PBA Pro Jersey.

Talk about throwing stones. Lucky controversy and 'stones' have been thrown at me my entire bowling career - im thick skinned - normally though its for 'how' I throw the ball, now its about for 'not' throwing the ball - kind of ironic huh?

I will bowl for Australia again, if at that point in time my priorities have changed. I truly hope i do.

Publicising the game at home and abroad - My response to that

My style has helped me win - but its also helped create a spark of interest in our game. Its something 'outside the square'. I am a topic of conversation on every forum in the bowling world at some point in time and I am also a topic of conversation for some news papers like The Wall St Journal, Boston Globe, LA TIMES, Daily telegraph, Tv shows, radio programs - Etc Etc
Each one asking for comments or interviews at sometimes crazy times in the night. On occasion i drive the 4 hours to Sydney from Orange for a 15 minute live in studio interview only to then drive back the hours home after its done.

(I would also like to take this opportunity to thank Lynne Clay who has set up so many interviews and shoots for me and for Australian Bowling. If only people knew Lynne what you do for us all - So thank you)

I have even flown around the world to do TV shows and talks and photo shoots to help elevate bowling's status amongst the media and the public.
I once flew from Korea to LA only to be told 30 minutes after I landed that the interview had been postponed for up to 3 weeks, I then had to fly back home that night - that one hurt!
I talk bowling to everyone I meet - in the street, on planes, taxi cab drivers, business men, politicians - im trying Geoff, i really am - but its clear not hard enough, otherwise my efforts would have reached your ears.

Look - i dont know it all, hell, none of us do. We offer our suggestions on this site as a way to get it off our chests and as a hope that maybe it will fall on some open ears.
If you think anyone here that has offered suggestions to help the bowling teams selection process as 'stones' then you are mistaken.
We say it because we love this game.
Would you rather no one said anything at all?

We need a lure to get our best players back in the mix - maybe structure and understanding will go a long way with getting those players mentioned back in an Australian shirt.
Or maybe its purely just funding - what ever we need, we need it soon!

This has been my thoughts - if you want to know what other peoples reasons are, best you single them out on this site as well.
I took the bait, maybe others will too - or unless you dont think its any of your business!

Proud Aussie

Geoff - one more thing. Thank you for doing what you can to help - we need more people like you, just hurts when your trying and people assume you dont care!
Hope to see you at another World Cup where we were both representing Australia again


Jb

Hi Jason

I have obviously not got my message across too well
in this case

Sorry about that

I am making a general statement about the great talent we have
in this Country that is not available and wouldnt it be great
If it was available, For all the reasons we have all stated herein

Not putting S!@T on people for not making themselves available
That is the last thing I would want to do , or suggest

Your efforts have not been fantastic and would not be questioned
certainly not by me

Bye the way, I dont drink, so no I was not drunk I just didnt write
it the way i wanted it to come out, so to speak

Cheers
Geoff
 
The crux of this whole thread is the statement "you should be funded to represent your Country."

Again with all due respect to the undoubtedly highly-talented players selected, it is just a shame that Australia will not be sending their best possible team to the Men's World Championships.

I can't imagine that seeking some sponsorship/s to create a funding pool to solve this problem isn't of the highest priority for TBA. If ever the time was right it's now, with all the publicity that Belmo is bringing to the sport and his country. Having witnessed him representing these two things, that he's clearly passionate about, in the US I can say unequivocally that there isn't a finer ambassador on both counts. He made me proud to be heard speaking with the same accent!

I'm long disconnected from Australia and the sport of bowling there directly, but will never recover from green and gold malaria and sincerely hope that TBA can galvanize the kind of support for Australia's national team expressed repeatedly in posts here (including consistent congratulations and encouragement to those that have made the team this time) and turn it into initiatives that helps solve the problem.

If there were a TBA committee or initiative that I could contribute meaningfully to from here I'd be happy to volunteer.
 
Sorry Geoff but I think you did go to far making any comment about Jason B and his efforts to assist and promote the game.

He has done more in his young years (I can say that given my age) than the vast majority of us have ever done to encourage, support and promote our game.

He genuinely is a credit to himself and bowling and should always be seen in that light.

Where I do think you are on point is that more people need to get involved through committees etc and see where they can play their part.

If you look at the majority of the committees (no disrespect intended) there is not much youth representation which is of great concern.

I believe our greatest frustration at the moment is that we do not appear to be learning from the past. Usually this is done by trying things, learning and then changing for the better.

The problem is/has been the number of reincarnations of the TBA and a lack of succession planning. Each new board has needed to learn and many have made the same mistakes as the previous.

The bowlers see this and the obvious "Here we go again" comments arise.

Hopefully with the new board, this time there will be the opportunity to take any learnings that can be derived and improve the process moving forward.


I have explained on other posts that the comments were not meant in this way
towards Jason, I would not do that and dont really have any reason to do that

He has done plenty

It would just be great to have him and others all back doing it again

In NSW we would like very much to have some Youth involved because
they are the future, lets hope we can do that

Sorry once again obviously it came across poorly

Cheers
Geoff
 
Geoff,

Like others i too appreciate you answering all the posts and threads, and hopefully some of it is getting back to the right people in the process and perhaps some good may come of all of this...

If it is perhaps we could relay this a little back to the TBA...

What has happened in the last TWO years that has changed dramatically...

We had an UNPAID Australian Coach who got off his death bed to go away with the team...We had most of what i would call bowlers with the most talent putting their hand up to represent their country...Barry got results and respect from all whom he gave advice to or even know him as a person...

No we have a PAID coach and not one of the top 10 male bowlers in this country nominating for the team...

I cant help but read between the lines...Maybe its loyalty or perhaps its the "why should he get paid to do a job that someone did for Love"...Or why should it cost us money as the bowler and the coach get a free ride? Or maybe its both...

Not sure maybe someone can make that clearer for me and others who have been asking the same question to me in private messages...

Yes shock i know but not everyone is game enough to post...
 
In NSW we would like very much to have some Youth involved because
they are the future, lets hope we can do that


I've been reading this topic, & thought I'd just point out that I know quite a few youth bowlers, including my self, who'd "have a go" at representing if it wasn't so expensive...
 
Ashley,

I think you will find that Geoff was responding to my post about youth involved in the committee side of things rather than nominting for representative teams.

Does show though how easily typed words can be misunderstood.
 
Hey Jase,

I understand what your saying but I also think the coach issue is not as great as some would believe.

I think that if you look at things we had a great crop of extremely young talent who all came through at the same time, were great mates and obviously really enjoyed each others company and were prepared to make sacrifices to stay together.

Now you have Walshy, Belmo, Quala and Mac Stewart with young families and when you do something for love, life gets in the way. You then have Mick Little and Jarrod who while may be in different situations are not prepared to make the amount of sacrifice when it is not to be with their best mates.

I know for me personally, it wasn't that I particularly wanted to stop bowling representatively when I did, just that my priorities changed and I started to consider what I might miss with my family and bowling away became a distant second.

So, while the dollars may be one issue, I wouldn't be surprised if the family ties has now made it more difficult for them to consider leaving. (Not that I am trying to speak for them)

That is nothing to be taken away from Barry and the immense sacrifices he made and I agree that he earned and deserved the repect of all. He is a true champion in my eyes and always will be.
 
I can't comment about the selection process apart from the fact that it is not clear & needs to be more fully explained. I can comment on the Walsh's and Barry's contribution to this sport - he is, and always has been an amazing support to Australian Bowlers & the fact that his contribution is not recognised is appauling. I will never be able to thank the Walsh family enough for their help and guidance with my bowling and consequently my life choices because bowling is everything to me. The cost of bowling is prohibitive but I love everything about this sport - apart from the backstabbing and politics.
 
I wasn't going to respond to any more messages on this thread... for the main reason that, yes, I don't bowl anymore! But posts in this thread have affected not only my husband, but his family and close friends of ours. Plus the small fact that I have travelled to MORE national tournaments than a few of those who are representing and coaching Australia this year...

I also agree with Jase, that I too thank Geoff for responding to most threads, even if some are read the wrong way! - its more than anyone has done on a committee behalf before.. It's a shame not all TBA committee members are willing to share some light on topics...

Here's an idea for anyone willing to pass on to a TBA committee member... why not get rid of a funded coach and instead use those funds to help the bowlers with some of their expenses.. yes, your right Roger Federer has a coach - but he has the SAME coach that travels with him all around the world - I don't believe, and correct me if I'm wrong, that he has a coach that never see's him play tennis in a year and then Roger expects him to go across the other side of the world to coach him in an event??? I doubt even Roger is that silly..

Nothing against the bowlers in this mens team, but Jase is right, my Father in law did get off his death bed to coach the mens team out of his own pocket, a team that had a lot of the higher named males in this country and they did get results. And for what??? Now they have a "funded" coach and none of the top 10 men... your right Jase, why doesn't the TBA see the connection in this....

As for youth or any other bowlers putting forward ideas to the TBA committee and 'having a go', unfortunately I have seen what happens to those who put ideas up against the TBA - if its not what the TBA want, you get shafted. And I suppose the TBA is only going to allow "youth" to come and have a say if its those that they personally select themselves...ones that are just going to agree with everything they have to say. TBA SHOULD be asking some of those "higher" ranked bowlers for some advice too..

Just my opinion...
 
Hey Jase,

I understand what your saying but I also think the coach issue is not as great as some would believe.

I think that if you look at things we had a great crop of extremely young talent who all came through at the same time, were great mates and obviously really enjoyed each others company and were prepared to make sacrifices to stay together.

Now you have Walshy, Belmo, Quala and Mac Stewart with young families and when you do something for love, life gets in the way. You then have Mick Little and Jarrod who while may be in different situations are not prepared to make the amount of sacrifice when it is not to be with their best mates.

I know for me personally, it wasn't that I particularly wanted to stop bowling representatively when I did, just that my priorities changed and I started to consider what I might miss with my family and bowling away became a distant second.

So, while the dollars may be one issue, I wouldn't be surprised if the family ties has now made it more difficult for them to consider leaving. (Not that I am trying to speak for them)

That is nothing to be taken away from Barry and the immense sacrifices he made and I agree that he earned and deserved the repect of all. He is a true champion in my eyes and always will be.


A very well thought out post
You may well be right , Family and money make a huge difference
to our availability in many aspects of our life

I have really enjoyed this long chat

Hope I have not upset anyone by getting some
of my words misread

I love the game and many of the people in it
and I will do whatever I can to make it better for
Bowlers, that is my aim

If I end up just bashing my head up against a
brick wall I will walk away too

Cheers
Geoff
 
I'm wondering -

how much money would it cost to send all the teams and it's staff to FIQ?
What's the sponsor/funding number?

As far as I'm concerned everyone posting/reading is in this thread for the right reasons. I have no doubt we will find a solution to this.
What's the worse that can happen with this debate?
We already pay for everything and don't have any structured training or any clear understanding what is required of players to make these teams - can it be worse? Please tell me it can't be worse!

Jb
 
Now you have Walshy, Belmo, Quala and Mac Stewart with young families and when you do something for love, life gets in the way. You then have Mick Little and Jarrod who while may be in different situations are not prepared to make the amount of sacrifice when it is not to be with their best mates.

Carl (aka Tiger), whilst I did love going away with my mates to represent Aust and still do enjoy going to event with them.....my sydney mortgage also has something to do with my decisions :)

Finally my last word on this matter..and it has already been said...I think the active discussion shows that everyone is very passionate about rep bowling and bowling in general and that has to be a good thing.....watch this space I am positive there are good things in the future for bowling!
 
Hey Jase,


Now you have Walshy, Belmo, Quala and Mac Stewart with young families and when you do something for love, life gets in the way. You then have Mick Little and Jarrod who while may be in different situations are not prepared to make the amount of sacrifice when it is not to be with their best mates.

I know for me personally, it wasn't that I particularly wanted to stop bowling representatively when I did, just that my priorities changed and I started to consider what I might miss with my family and bowling away became a distant second.

So, while the dollars may be one issue, I wouldn't be surprised if the family ties has now made it more difficult for them to consider leaving. (Not that I am trying to speak for them)



Totally agree with what you have said Carl its very hard to find the time and money with kids and a mortgage.

Lets just hope things start to move forward so our young families can enjoy all the success and enjoyment we have all got out of representing our country in thier futures as i know we all have found that not much compares to standing on the dias hearing your national anthem with a gold medal around your neck!

I am forever thankful that i had the opportunity to bowl with some of these great guys over the years and learnt more about the game whilst away than from any bolwing in australia.

Good luck to all the guys who are going to worlds and asian zone enjoy the experience and soak up wearing the Green and Gold its an awesome feeling.

Cheers
 
I'm wondering -

how much money would it cost to send all the teams and it's staff to FIQ?
What's the sponsor/funding number?

Jb

Great question Jason.

With the answer to that question in hand, I wonder if this company: www.momentumww.com.au/ could be a worthwhile resource for TBA to pursue? It's a funky site but go to the Company tab at the bottom and then click on the Sponsorship pebble/rock. Also go to the Work tab and then click on the Tooheys New Case Study. BTW, I have no connection with this company at all, just came across them this week via a client I have back in Oz and thought it coincidental.
 
I truly hope the discussion taken place in this thread goes towards improving all aspects of this great sport we all enjoy so much

To Geoff, once again, many thanks for your responses...you have been a breath of fresh air......I hope you did not get to despondent with some of the questions & responses

To the teams representing Australia at both Worlds & Asian
Wear your Australian colours with pride & bowl with your heart on your sleeve

It truly is the best feeling you will have in your bowling life!!!!!!!!

Good luck to all

Cheers
Colin Hunt
 
Hey people, As a side note

If you check the TBA wbsite there is now a position available
on the NAtional board for " Bowlers Representative"

Might be worth someone having a crack at it

Cheers
Geoff
 
I truly hope the discussion taken place in this thread goes towards improving all aspects of this great sport we all enjoy so much

To Geoff, once again, many thanks for your responses...you have been a breath of fresh air......I hope you did not get to despondent with some of the questions & responses

To the teams representing Australia at both Worlds & Asian
Wear your Australian colours with pride & bowl with your heart on your sleeve

It truly is the best feeling you will have in your bowling life!!!!!!!!

Good luck to all

Cheers
Colin Hunt

Hi Colin

To be honest I have enjoyed it

Sometimes you have to confront things and
suffer a bit of angst to sort stuff through

This thread could go on for a Long, long time
and would bring out many different issues and
statistics on results, representation, behaviour
issues, whos up who etc etc
But lets not spoil it by downgrading the efforts
of those in this Team so we can wish them
every sucess they and our great country deserve

I will always do my best to be upfront and honest
about issues herein

I would encourage a PM on any subject you
want to try to get answers on

Cheers
Geoff
 
Hey Jase,

I understand what your saying but I also think the coach issue is not as great as some would believe.

Now you have Walshy, Belmo, Quala and Mac Stewart with young families and when you do something for love, life gets in the way. You then have Mick Little and Jarrod who while may be in different situations are not prepared to make the amount of sacrifice when it is not to be with their best mates.

Sorry for the long post but.

I have only just noticed this post as don't get on TB much these days, but I will say in response to Carl's post above, over the last few years, things have conspired in differing circumstances which have prevented me from participating in the national team like I would like to. I would love the chance to compete for my country again and certainly more than I have in the past. I have been away for two youth trips and two adult trips for a return of 4 gold medals. I have also been on what I feel the wrong end of many selections over the years, have point blank been told by the coach or selectors if I hadnt of rolled my way into the team I wouldnt have gone even if I had been bowling well in tournaments or was high in the rankings at the time.

After the Worlds in 2003 I wasnt able to afford the Asian zone trip to Thailand the year after, the next Worlds in Korea I wasnt selected, feedback I received from two of the selectors included clangers such as "if he missed original nomination dates he must not be interested in going" (I missed original dates due to not bowling for about 3 months because of injury) and "just because he won the masters at previous worlds, does not mean he should be selected this time", that was about as constructive as it got from two of them.

2007 I went for the Asian champs and made it, bowled reasonably well and enjoyed the trip. The next worlds and the roll off happened to coincide with the first weekend of a planned family holiday, so because I didnt attend the roll off, I couldnt be selected, another trip down the pipes, this year I had nominated for the trip to Germany but the cost became prohibitive (ie new retaining wall or trip overseas with no return) and unfortunately Amanda's Nan passed away that weekend as well and was a pretty tough time for everyone. And as for not nominating for UAE, the cost is where it lies again. It just isnt worth it and isnt because I dont get to travel with my mates. Mortgages, renovations, family holidays all play a bigger part.

I do agree with Carl, I dont have too many issues with having a paid national coach, but what I do feel is that more needs to be seen on the surface to where all the planning or development is going.

I have not seen Chris at a national tournament this year, not sure why? I don't know how far his responsibilities stretch as part of being national coach so not sure if he is required to do so or not, but would have thought it to be a good idea. On the surface there doesn't seem to be a progression for bowlers to follow ie a set development plan to ensure the future of bowling. Is this part of the coaches responsibilities? I am not sure. Jase is right, there are and have been far to many bowlers over the years in the youth ranks that have shown potential only for them to disappear altogether.

You only need to look at just about any other sport in the world to see how progression is made to the top level. Why is it so hard for bowling to follow?

1. No stability in the head organisation, until recent months, reliant on too many people going in different directions all with their own agendas, before Cara I don't think too many would disagree the previous CEOs have been a cancer to the sport.
2. Which leads to the reversal or perhaps removal of some of our sport commission funding, lower membership numbers, different bowling organisations not willing to be under the one. Remember back in the day when everyone who bowled a league regardless of centre also was required to pay a membership fee? Imagine the money TBA would have if this were to be the case today. Imagine what they could use this money for? It sh*ts me to think that people whinge over a price increase of a few dollars for a sport they are supposed to love, yet are happy to p*ss it up the wall spending 10 bucks in the cafe.
3. Previous attempts to develop state structures, coaching or development have failed, see point 1. From point 2, extra money, means extra promotion, extra funds to develop coaching programs, building bowling up in participation numbers as a sport, not just social play.
4. Starting in the grass roots, I remember when I started bowling, there were people employed at the centre to help new bowlers learn more about the game, once I progressed a bit, there were coaches at different levels. See pt 2 & 3. Maybe because the centre I bowled in cared about the bowlers and was an independant compared to the money hungry corporate now?
5. Now too many people that have been burnt before are not willing to bother now, who can blame some of them when their suggestions have been shot down in flames, refer pt 1 again. I agree in principle to a suggestion that Geoff had, higher profile bowlers should do more when they can. I have always been more than happy to help whether it be helping junior bowlers at training camps, helping with president shield selections, it is usually always fun and I feel like I am contributing in a small way to helping.

It stuffs me what the answer is, but you have to wonder how much longer bowling can go for without it changing for the better?
 
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