Using stuff to fix ball surfaces

[milkman]

I recently made a phone call to Columbia about my Reaction Ricochet I bought, and told them that the ball was lacking the bite it had when I first got it.

They told me the pores get blocked up, and takes the reaction away, and suggested I use acetone to clear the pores up.

Ive been told that this is illegal however, can someone confirm this? Im eagerly looking at ways to restore it to the way it was when I first got it

 

[AdrianS]

Now here's a situation that i don't think the rules are very clear on. I know it's illegal to use acetone during competition to clean a ball, but how about out of competition eg at home or in the pro shop. Do any 'rules' at all apply there, seeing that all sorts of other things are used like ovens, dishwashers, dishwashing liquid, handy andy(that really makes a ball tacky)etc...

Now here are somethings i want cleared up

I've read about some rule changes the ABC in the US made a few years ago relating to resurfacing balls by hand during competition. I think the Squeaky Clean company had some polishes approved for this. Were these rules carried over to Australia and if not why not.

Can a ball be put in a luster king

(a) during bowling

(b) or between squads or events

Can a scotch brite pad or sandpaper be in situation b

I think some of the rules concerning equipment aren't made very clear on entry forms. I know Patrick Birtig put together a brief guide on how these rules apply in competition a couple of years ago but not a lot of people would have seen it. Can someone please clear some of the queries up?

 

[nicola]

hi all,
i have always believed that you cant alter the surface of a ball at all once you have started bowing. you can alter the surface inbetween squads, but, not on the premisis of the bowl, this means you cant use a scotch brite when bowling adrian.
the use of acetone is interesting as it works great on the older equipment but i have been told it is no good for the new reactives etc??? maybe a balldriller may know more about this.

 

[Brenton Davy]

Milky,

I don't know who at Columbia suggested you use acetone to clean the ball but you would be greatly decreasing the legal life of the ball if you do so. Acetone is a solvent, very similar to the methylethylketone that the pros used in the 1970's during the "soaker" phase.

I have experimented with acetone and I can tell you that cleaning a ball fro about 5 mins with a cloth with acetone on it DOES break down the molecular structure of the surface. In this experiment I was able to leave an impression in the ball with my thumb nail after a few minutes.

If you use acetone, then the ball will be illegally soft before too long.

Do so at your own risk

 

[makka]

What would all you people out there suggest people use tp clean their bowling balls then. Cause everyone i know has the same problem. I know my bowling ball lost its tackyness a while back, and it gets to the stage now that if i leave my bag in the car, when it comes time to bowl, i rip the ball out of the bag and it is just covered with oil. I realise this is because of my own mismanagement, but seriously ive never been shown how to look after a ball, how to clean a ball stuff like that.

 

[RobbieB]

Firstly, acetone and most other organic solvents (metho, petrol dry cleaning fluid etc) are illegal to use at any time by ABC rules (and I would imagine by TBA as well). The only organic solvent allowed by the ABC is isopropyl alcohol (rubbing alcohol). This is because of the 'soaker' era back in '73 or so, acetone won't actually harm urethane unless you leave it in a bucket of it for a while. As for cleaning the ball, tape up the fingers and thumb holes and soak it in a tub of hot water with a liberal amount of Dawn dishwashing liquid, (Dawn really is the best) and give it a good scrub.
I actually ran some experiments at uni to find out what leaks out of the ball when they heat up, and I'm reasonably convinced it's not oil, but the excess plasticiser ('resin') put in the shell of reactive urethane balls. FWIW, before running the tests I was convinced it 'was' lane oil. Thermoset resins (like urethanes) continue to cure for a long time, and this tends to keep forcing excess plasticiser out of the shell. I analysed the exudate from a SD73 by gas chromatography against a sample of lane oil and they were nothing like each other. In fact the major (99%+) component of the ooze from the SD73 matched the description of a typical additive mentioned in one of Columbia's patents fron the era of the yellow dot bleeders. There is a lot of accessible patent literature on bowling balls and a lot of it makes facinating reading.
As for replacing the tackiness, you want a very thin film of the resin goop to ooze up the surface. Give the ball a good clean then polish with any of the commercial ball rejuvenator polishes. Or just get the surface hot on a spinner with a bit of cutting compound, or for a really nice cheap polish, try Brasso (really!).
This holds for resin. Particle balls need even more cleaning than regular resin - soak and scrub with a stiff brush to get the crap out of the pores. A wipe over with rubbing alcohol after each time you bowl will help keep them clean too, but be careful with polishing or resurfacing them as doing it wrong can screw up some particale balls.
BTW, it is illegal (ABC rule) to use 'abrasives' on the surface of a ball in competition. For some unknown reason, Lustre Kings and other ball polishers are OK in competition (even though they use abrasives). Rubbing alcohol is OK by ABC rule - don't know if TBA rules are different, but I assume not.

Robbie B.

 

[jimcross]

Will you all please stop being silly. If the ball manufacturers made coverstock surfaces that you were meant to be able to restore to original or,at least close to original,they'd probably drop a huge percentage of their sales. If it was able to be done successfully,the pro's would'nt change to new balls every few games. Hope you all have a ball trying!!!!!

 

[RobbieB]

Jim,
The ones who change 'every few games' are not buying their gear - they are staff bowlers. Anyone who knows what they are doing can restore a ball to 90%+ of factory condition in most cases. I even know a guy in the States (a proshop operator) who routinely resurfaces his own equipment out of the box so he knows exactly what the surface was when he first threw it.
Bowling balls are sanded to shape and polished to factory finish before shipping. It's not rocket science. Effective ball life simply depends on how much care you take of them.
Robbie B.

 

[GeorgeF]

Robbie and others

Do not wash your ball with hot water, why? because your ball has pores on them, not only for soaking up oil but any liquid which is put on it. If you soak your ball in water to clean it, it will ABSORB the water resultng in water going in to the core. In case you don't understand what I'm trying to say, IT IS BAD!!!!!

There are several products out in the states which combat this problem, one is called Track " Clean and Dull ". This product looks like green slim and when placed on the ball soaks into the pores. It then reacts with the oil bringing it to the surface, extracting the oil from the ball and keeping the ball at it's new tacky condition. This is not only legal but very good for all your reactive and proactive equipement. Ball companies and companies such as Neo-Tac spend alot of money testing different products to ensure the best possible results. If it was easy as washing the ball or placing it in the oven, they would have gone out of business ago.

This reminds me, DON'T PUT YOUR BALL IN THE OVEN EITHER. Whilst it does extract oil, it does so unevenly because some oil falls from the sides of the ball down to the tray, the oil from the top of the ball soaks back into the coverstock. Even if you do 12 sides in this process you will never have a EVEN distribution of oil extraction.

My best advice is to stick to the products that work and are designed for bowling. 3M Finesse-It blocks the pores of the ball and it useless. If you want to re-surface your ball use scotch bright pads not sand paper. Scotch bright paper comes in different grades, it also ensures that you don't re-surface the particles off your ball, it's almost impossible to put flat spots on your ball when you use it as well.

I hope it helps, George

 

[jimcross]

Rob - My first post was a bit tongue-in-cheek. It is an interesting and quite important subject, so I’ll remove the tongue from its prior position. Firstly, what you said about cleaning a ball - hot water - dawn, etc., is 100% right. You can use all the fancy specialty cleaners you like and still get the best result from your method. Makka would be well advised to do as you suggest - he will be amazed at the results.
In fact I agree with most of what you said, except for two points - "anyone who knows" --- can restore a fall to 90% + etc." and "I’m reasonably convinced it’s not oil".
Now, I know you only said "I’m REASONABLY convinced it’s not oil", but I think there may be some factor there which is corrupting your results.
This is why I think so, and I know that theis is mainly anecdotal evidence, but we’ve all probably seen instances where vast sums of money have been expended to gain proper scientific evidence of something which everybody knew anyhow, based on anecdotal evidence.
Here’ s a few questions which seem to point to ‘oil’ being absorbed into the ball & altering its performance.

1. Take a ‘plastic’ ball, bowl it on a lane with reasonable quantities and length of oil and look at the oil on its surface. Then take a reactive, pro active, etc., - make sure you take a line through the oil and then find little or no oil on the surface of the ball - Where has it gone?
2. Wipe your finger on the lane and smear oil on each of the above balls and wait and then see the difference. Again - where did it go?
3. I have a ball - Danger Zone, Black Ice - Pearl - which I have been using since (I think) 1995. It has been cleaned more often than I could put a figure on (your method) plus perhaps about a hundred times heated and cleaned repeatedly until little or no oil (or plasticiser) comes out. Bowl it for a while, and I can get as much out again, and so on and so on,apparently endlessly. Just how much plasticiser can possibly be in these things?

Have been experimenting with a method of extracting all of whatever it is which appears wet on the outside of a ball, in a car boot or in the sun, etc., for some time now. That is, to do so quickly, easily and reliably - seem to be approaching success and finality. Have been able to get a ball to the stage where no further ‘oil’ or whatever will come out, and if the ball is not used, later attempts to provoke some exudation from the ball fail, but after use of the ball, it can be made to ‘weep’ again!
Something I haven’t tried would be interesting. Try heating a new unused ball to see what, if anything, comes out.
Finally, and this is really in the anecdotal category.
How many of you out there, have drilled up a new ball and it’s been pure magic, especially with carry, but after a while, no matter what you do to it, it never does what it used to do?
Is everybody who has had this experience fooling themselves?
I’ve just thought of something else. This would be interesting if you have the facilities. Take a new ball, drilled and ready for use, and weigh it, ACCURATELY (not on a do-do scale) - use it well, and prior to cleaning it, weigh it again. Then heat it and clean it as often as necessary to achieve a reasonably ‘dry’ surface and weigh it again.
If it’s heavier on first weighing, it’s probably lane oil. If it comes back to the same weight at the second weighing it confirms its lane oil. If it’s lighter on second weighing there’s at least some plasticiser removed.
The difference in the various weights should give some indication of the percentages of lane oil / plasticisers.

 

[RobbieB]

George,
Modern balls don't soak up water to any great extent. The polymers are just too hydrophobic - the oils and resins in the coverstock repel the water. I have been washing my gear and others in hot water for years.
Also, the stuff that comes out of the ball when you heat it is not lane oil, as I said in my earlier post. If you want to argue with that, I'll bring the GC traces to Ballina and show you.
You are right about the oven, and about sandpaper and particle balls. Sandpaper works fine on resin, though, and correctly resurfacing with a spinner won't put flat spots on the ball no matter what you use.

Rob.

 

[jimcross]

Just read George and Rob's last posts. I believe you can safely and effectively put a ball in an oven,provided you don't think you are cooking a casserole. I use a very moderate heat,watch the ball,and as soon as wet parts appear on the surface,take it out and wipe it off [usually with absorbant paper ] I just keep doing this -- it takes a lot of patience -- I change the ball position every time,and the ball never gets very hot.

 

[RobbieB]

Jim,
My objection to the oven treatment is not so much that it doesn't work, but that you need patience and a good oven to avoid melting your ball into a shapeless blob! Hot water is just as effective and safer. According to many on ASB, a dishwasher is also effective, without the drying cycle.
As for the 'oil' coming out of the ball, go to the USPTO website <http://www.uspto.gov/patft/index.html> and look up patent no. 4,253,665 (Miller, for Columbia). Remember the yellow dot bleeders? They could ooze crap for years. According to this patent, from 5 to 25% BY WEIGHT of the coverstock can be plasticiser!
I have done the experiment with a new ball - a hair dryer on the surface of an undrilled original night hawk made it bleed.
Now, I am not suggesting that balls don't soak up oil. I have cut old yellow dot in half and seen the oil stains in the core. The new balls would be even worse, IMHO. I just don't think it comes out again - the cores are mostly polystyrene, which is the chemically most similar part to lane oil, so I think it mostly goes in and keeps going in.
The tests I ran were on a state of the art gas chromatograph/mass spectrometer system. The goop gave one peak. Lane oil gave a different peak. A mixture of both gave two peaks, one for each component. Add the fact that the ooze from the ball matched the chemical description of one of the placticiser classes mentioned in the patent, and I'm convinced that SD73's, at least, don't leak lane oil. I haven't gotten around to testing all my gear yet, but I will.
As for balls losing hit, you are right - some seem to 'die' much quicker than others. It seems a bit much to blame this on oil absorbtion, when they should all **** it up at the same rate. But what if some balls simply lose resin much faster than others? What's left is basically a urethane ball, and if its lost 10% of its filler, spongy urethane at that. Might explian why some balls hit like lamingtons after a month.
Like I said, I expected to prove it _was_ laneoil, not disprove it. I'm waiting for one of my balls to _completely_ die so I can stick it in a high vac oven and see what distills out, but I don't have one I am willing to sacrifice just yet.
Any donations gratefully accepted in the name of science, of course...

Rob.

 

[jimcross]

Thanks Rob,like you I want to KNOW. I wonder if there's anyone else out there who can add anything serious and informed to this discussion? Particularly relating to those balls which turn into powderpuffs after not much use. With the value of the A$ and the price of balls generally and the virtual impossibility of being competitive without a ball which works,we'll end up with the last man standing will be the one able to afford just one more ball than anyone else.
Any manufacturer out there who might tell us the secret?

 

[makka]

Since you blokes seem to know a boat load more about this than i do, maybee you can help. I got a hold of some fancy you beaut ball cleaner. incidently it was Degree dull'n shine from columbia. It worked well restoring the tacky finish to the ball. I dont have oil oooziing out of it anymore, but it has lost its hitting power. A friend of mine seems to think that the ball is stuffed becuase i left it sit around for 3 months, and didnt drain it beforehand. He thinks the problem is that oil has soaked in and hardened in the core. Does this happen? or is it one of these old wives tales.

Makka

 

[PC]

Anyone tried the new "REVIVOR" machine Bowlers World has at Ed Fleming Lanes for removing oil?

 

[RobbieB]

Makka, give it a hot bath with some detergent - let it soak for 10 minutes, give it a scrub, then soak & scrub again. Depending on how tracked up it is, it may need resurfacing, too. What sort of ball is it and how many games are on it?
Rob.

 

[Graham]

i'd like to know what Scott Sadler does to clean etc his equipment .. he has that old (Fire ??) Red Quantum that he is still bowling with and still doing well with it .. no lost hitting power there ..

 

[makka]

Rob

Its a tec messenger, and its probably got 150 games up on it.

 

[Hippy??]

If you read this Robbie I was just reading your posts on the other page and in the interests of science I have an old resin Hammer that I would be willing to donate to you. This subject has always been of interest to me so I would be very interested to find out. Just for the record I too have always cleaned my gear in the sink. Seems to work just fine to me but I haven't done this to much of my resin stuff yet, but more than likely will.