8 pins a game.. with a twist

Mankind_280

Mankind_280

I've converted #stormnation
Hi Everyone,

I know this might seems silly but i think I have a legitimate point. Biased but legitimate

With Girls getting 8 pins a game at newcastle cup ( i don't have an issue with it I promise) and other events, due to carry percentage being lower why not have other divisions with 8 pins such as seniors or disability.

I know I'm not the most liked guy but I think I have a point.

Where at the disabled bowlers competing in the national events> How how is a disability worth per game.

I know sometimes i feel stuffed after 4 games and others 12 but surely restriction on seniors wrists and bowlers with disability having restrictions why isn't it offered for others?

Please comment even its to flame me...

James Sitters
 
James

I am not quite sure If my response is directed correctly to your
questioning listed above however this is how I read it

I'm sorry mate this is not something that should be explored
there are lots of events for people with a disability to contest

The 8 pin thing for women is a separate issue for discussion....

The Women get 8 pins because they need to be able to compete in an open event with the Men
as the number of women are in decline and Women only events are limited.

Able bodied people are unable to contest a disabled event, that is how it should be
however if people with a disability would like to contest an open event then go ahead
but it is just that , an open event.

Without any disrespect to someone with a disability, as I have one myself, we can not
have a situation where these open events have people contesting them with wheel chairs etc.

As for seniors, well that too is another story of it's own At age 55 I am in that category and can tell you
I would not expect or want 4 or 8 pins a game to contest an open event....

Bowling is quite an interesting Sport already given I can enter an open event and Bowl with the best
Bowlers in the country, even if I am a crap bowler..... Imagine turning up to the Australian Open, paying
your fees and drawing Tiger Woods as a partner for 18 holes, I think not..

This just my opinion and again without disrespect to anyone.
 
Point taken Geoff, thanks for your input... Just thought on saturday Night literally crossed my mind.. I thought I'd pose the question.

It is an open event and a choice and when I do bowl tournaments now a days I'm well aware its a choice and I would prefer to compete against everybody

Although I've always wondered if I could compete on the disabled circuit... I don't know much about it

Regards

James
 
Mankind_280 said:
Point taken Geoff, thanks for your input... Just thought on saturday Night literally crossed my mind.. I thought I'd pose the question.

It is an open event and a choice and when I do bowl tournaments now a days I'm well aware its a choice and I would prefer to compete against everybody

Although I've always wondered if I could compete on the disabled circuit... I don't know much about it

Regards

James
Click to expand...


James

Contact the TBA in QLD Office
The new classifications for a disabled person are much wider than
they once were, which is a bit of a joke really...

They can give you all the details you require

cheers
Geoff
 
8 pins bonus for females is wrong policy in my opinion.
Take last weekends Newcastle Cup as example.
Females represented only 15% of total entries, yet were 22% of the top 18.
The scores, without bonuses would have had 1 female still make the cut, this shows the females are capable of competing without the assistance of bonus pins. (Colombia's Clara Guerrero recently made the Show for PBA Cheetah Championship on her own merits )
With bonuses females made up 40% of the top 5 placings after having been only 15% of total entries, a disproportionate result, surely.
When I look through the names, I see at least 1 junior bowler entered, if we are going to give advantage to any group, it should be the ones who represent the future of the sport.
I fail to see where the current policy is producing greater numbers of females entering tournaments, its the same names appearing, bonuses or not.
 
I agree with your above statement about the women's numbers at events. From what I've seen, the 8 pin per game bonus available to women, does not seem to have attracted any more women to the nationally ranked events. You see the same women competing at most of the tournaments. So if the aim of the 8 pins per game for women, was to increase women's entries, then I think it's failed.
 
Mistagear said:
8 pins bonus for females is wrong policy in my opinion.
Take last weekends Newcastle Cup as example.
Females represented only 15% of total entries, yet were 22% of the top 18.
The scores, without bonuses would have had 1 female still make the cut, this shows the females are capable of competing without the assistance of bonus pins. (Colombia's Clara Guerrero recently made the Show for PBA Cheetah Championship on her own merits )
With bonuses females made up 40% of the top 5 placings after having been only 15% of total entries, a disproportionate result, surely.
When I look through the names, I see at least 1 junior bowler entered, if we are going to give advantage to any group, it should be the ones who represent the future of the sport.
I fail to see where the current policy is producing greater numbers of females entering tournaments, its the same names appearing, bonuses or not.
Click to expand...

I was there watching the Newcastle Cup
It was a very tough condition to bowl on
The pins was worth more like 20

Having said that a few managed to bowl okay on it
and Bec and Bee worked hard

What it does show to me is that a Centre without an appropriate Kegel
technology machine should not be attempting to put down required patterns
as they simply don't work.
The TBA are at fault for this not the Centre
 
Geoff300 said:
I was there watching the Newcastle Cup
It was a very tough condition to bowl on
The pins was worth more like 20

Having said that a few managed to bowl okay on it
and Bec and Bee worked hard

What it does show to me is that a Centre without an appropriate Kegel
technology machine should not be attempting to put down required patterns
as they simply don't work.
The TBA are at fault for this not the Centre
Click to expand...

What lane machine did the center use?
 
I honestly believe the weekend was a bad example showing that the ladies did or did not need the eight pins because EVERYONE struggled. Some patterns, most patterns suit the men a lot more then females.

This was my first mixed adult tournament and I definitely will be bowling again, with or without the eight pins.

And we need to remember that this improvement in numbers is not going to change over night, it is going to take time. When females see other females doing well against the men then it will encourage them to start competing too. We have 15 for the Kegal Open in March which is a great number and its only going to get bigger over time.
 
If you reckon numbers are the theme, why aren't juniors (male and female) offered a head start also, surely the next generation of stars are more important than attracting a couple more females ? or better still.............Why not take some of the prize fund away from the rich and famous usual suspects, and use it to entice a second tier category at national level, say sub 180av Premier Class where the extra females, along with the up and coming juniors could compete.
Yes, I know...sandbagging will be the excuse not to try it, but that can easily be remedied with making a few simple reverse handicap rules once a competitor places in the lower category, making it less attractive proposition to be bothered with sandbagging.
So please, tell me why we dont try to tap the vast numbers of sub 180 players into national tournaments ?
 
But how do you determine the sub 180 average bowlers? Some people bowl on really tough patterns during league who are decent bowlers and have averages in the 180's. Then you have others who bowl on a house pattern where you can bowl with your eyes closed and average telephone numbers yet in a tournament are lucky to average 180 sometimes

In terms of letting juniors have the eight pins then suggest it to TBA . No point saying it on here because the issues won't get addressed
 
Personally, I was willing to give the 8 pins a game a go for the sake of increasing entries, so far this year, for this purpose it has proved the opposite. As someone has alluded to, the same (more or less) female competitors bowl the events anyway. The same 5-10 females bowl the events give or take wherever the tournament is located, not 20-30 females bowling to increase entries like hoped. The question is, has this in turn sacrificed some male entries as they figure they will miss out on the cusp of matchplay/cash spots?

The Newcastle Cup was somewhat an anomaly in some regards, as a brutal pattern that never opened up tends to lend itself to those who throw a straighter shot a much better ability to stay consistent and score, in this case, two of the female competitors were up the top.

The only way IMO that the 8 pins for females should remain is to adopt similar principles to Europe whereby a female registering a placing in a tournament then loses the privilege for 12 months. But at the moment, I don't see any real reason for keeping the 8 pins, entries haven't increased.
 
Mistagear said:
If you reckon numbers are the theme, why aren't juniors (male and female) offered a head start also, surely the next generation of stars are more important than attracting a couple more females ? or better still.............Why not take some of the prize fund away from the rich and famous usual suspects, and use it to entice a second tier category at national level, say sub 180av Premier Class where the extra females, along with the up and coming juniors could compete.
Yes, I know...sandbagging will be the excuse not to try it, but that can easily be remedied with making a few simple reverse handicap rules once a competitor places in the lower category, making it less attractive proposition to be bothered with sandbagging.
So please, tell me why we dont try to tap the vast numbers of sub 180 players into national tournaments ?
Click to expand...


I am not aware of any rich and famous, care to elaborate
 
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