Hey Willey,
Yeah, I thought I should remain politically correct. Apparently those synthetics affect their balls as well. Something about size.....
John Velo
The day the game changed for ever
- Thread starter GeorgeF
- Start date
Hey Willey,
Yeah, I thought I should remain politically correct. Apparently those synthetics affect their balls as well. Something about size.....
John Velo
jimcross
Active Member
Yes George, we know what year we're in. The question really is, just because it's newer or happened later, does that equate to being better?
Let's say, George, you walked under a 'bus to-day, must that mean that to-day is better than yesterday? ( this is not an open invitation for comments from people other than George, as it is possible that opinions may vary.)
Tell you what I don't like, and what I think makes the arguement for those of us who believe the technology should be wound back for the good of the sport, is the constant question after a high score " WHAT BALL WAS IT"??, or, George, in your case, yesterday,
" QUOTE :-Re: EJ Starkey rolls another !
Not surprised the Virtual World strikes again! Nice bowling mate, what have I been telling you about Storm? better grab a few more of those Virtual Worlds and keep them for a rainy day......... George F "
Come on, so you're in the present, but why stop there - why not a remote control for the ball ? - Later maybe operated via satellite from home.
When the time comes, George, and someone tells you to remember that it's 2050, and you need a time machine, just go quietly.
When Joe Velo bowled our first 300, who would have been stupid enough to ask what sort of ball it was? Then we all knew that it was bowlers who scored - not balls.
Troyza
Flash
Remote control is hardly an accurate anology for reactive resin. It still takes skill to repeat shots? & Last time I heard, it takes a bowler to 'bowl' a ball...
& I don't really think ball technology has much further it can go legally (then again, I'm not sure). Start complaining about lane surfaces & kegels
I'm sort of out of the loop when it comes to tennis, but did any of the pro athletes complain about their new blue playing surface & hwo it changed the game? I don't really think I heard much complaining, just more adjusting. A surface which gave them more grip, & higher retained ball energy or something? I won't even start on the rackets.
Things change! Is it really the integrity of the sport people are worried about? Or just their own abilities or inabilities to adapt to the 'new' sport? If it's integrity, then target lane conditioning practices for league, not the gear. We've already pointed out gear evolves in every sport, don't see why bowling should be left in the lurch.
& I don't really think ball technology has much further it can go legally (then again, I'm not sure). Start complaining about lane surfaces & kegels
I'm sort of out of the loop when it comes to tennis, but did any of the pro athletes complain about their new blue playing surface & hwo it changed the game? I don't really think I heard much complaining, just more adjusting. A surface which gave them more grip, & higher retained ball energy or something? I won't even start on the rackets.
Things change! Is it really the integrity of the sport people are worried about? Or just their own abilities or inabilities to adapt to the 'new' sport? If it's integrity, then target lane conditioning practices for league, not the gear. We've already pointed out gear evolves in every sport, don't see why bowling should be left in the lurch.
Casual Observer
Member
Yeah it takes skill to repeat shots. BUT....It doesn't take skill to throw the ball in a 10 board area and strike every shot like happens at some places.
jimcross
Active Member
Troyza, I can fully understand your point of view. What you see at present in bowling, is what has always been, and what you have always seen. I can see no reason why you should have a different view.
I've seen that too. I've also seen a different senario. Having seen both, I choose the earlier system. I think it more truly reflected the relative abilities of bowlers.
Sure, advances in technology are inevitable, but a regulating body with some clout is vital to preserve the integrity of regulations: an example being:- " Ball Balance".
The 2 or 3 ounces (the exact weight is unimportant ) of imbalance in static weight allowed was plainly meant to contain the balance of the ball within quite small limits.
This in turn was supposed to limit the balls 'turning ability' to whatever the bowler could impart with his / her release. ( No 'Bobweight" effect.)
This is what that rule was for. It's intent was crystal clear, however, manufacturers manipulated weight blocks, so that the static weight limits could be maintained, while the 'rolling' or dynamic balance could create a variety of virtually unlimited 'Bobweight" effects.
This should have been disallowed immediately, on the grounds that it was against the intent and 'spirit' of the rule.
This would have even survived a legal challenge, as there are numerous judgments upholding similar decisions in a number of legal jurisdictions around the world.
It was a cornerstone of bowling that the ball was in, or very close, to balance.
As I said, sure there are and will always be advances in technology, but you'll seldom, if ever, find any approved by other sports that change an actual basic of that sport.
Addition:-------Hi, John, I'd been trying to remember what that 1960s black rubber AMF ball of mine was. An AMFLITE! .... Thanks... That's it in my Avatar on the left, but I can't read the label !!! It's all those revs !!
I've seen that too. I've also seen a different senario. Having seen both, I choose the earlier system. I think it more truly reflected the relative abilities of bowlers.
Sure, advances in technology are inevitable, but a regulating body with some clout is vital to preserve the integrity of regulations: an example being:- " Ball Balance".
The 2 or 3 ounces (the exact weight is unimportant ) of imbalance in static weight allowed was plainly meant to contain the balance of the ball within quite small limits.
This in turn was supposed to limit the balls 'turning ability' to whatever the bowler could impart with his / her release. ( No 'Bobweight" effect.)
This is what that rule was for. It's intent was crystal clear, however, manufacturers manipulated weight blocks, so that the static weight limits could be maintained, while the 'rolling' or dynamic balance could create a variety of virtually unlimited 'Bobweight" effects.
This should have been disallowed immediately, on the grounds that it was against the intent and 'spirit' of the rule.
This would have even survived a legal challenge, as there are numerous judgments upholding similar decisions in a number of legal jurisdictions around the world.
It was a cornerstone of bowling that the ball was in, or very close, to balance.
As I said, sure there are and will always be advances in technology, but you'll seldom, if ever, find any approved by other sports that change an actual basic of that sport.
Addition:-------Hi, John, I'd been trying to remember what that 1960s black rubber AMF ball of mine was. An AMFLITE! .... Thanks... That's it in my Avatar on the left, but I can't read the label !!! It's all those revs !!
GeorgeF
Hypercell = Hyperhook!
Jim I am having the exact same disagreement with some bowlers in the US on the PBA forums about the evolution of bowling and how it has damaged the sport. Here is my last post in relation to the matter I just posted today
"Your perception of bowling is distorted because you know the history of it. Think about the consumers and the younger generation who don't know where bowling came from. They know no better and enjoy the sport for what it is. You dislike the sport now because you have seen it evolve into something you dont like. Spare a though for the new generation...."
Technology is here to stay.....
"Your perception of bowling is distorted because you know the history of it. Think about the consumers and the younger generation who don't know where bowling came from. They know no better and enjoy the sport for what it is. You dislike the sport now because you have seen it evolve into something you dont like. Spare a though for the new generation...."
Technology is here to stay.....
Troyza
Flash
10 boards is an exageration that im sort of tired of hearing. Or am I seriously just lucky enough to not have come accross a THS that litterally lets you put the ball down between 10 boards & let you hit the pocket?
Ah I see where you are coming from, Jim. Like george says, Youth of today don't really know the sport as being any different, so we are sort of trapped in 2 different era's & will probably never come to terms. :L
jimcross
Active Member
"Your perception of bowling is distorted because you know the history of it". --Quote from George.
Goodness George, that's an interesting postulation. Do you realise that you are seriously asserting that the less you know about a subject, the better your understanding of it will be! Try that theory out reading the lane conditions at your next tournament, regardless of the ball you use. Try it out when you drill your next ball, etc., etc.
Try not to be silly.
Jim.
Goodness George, that's an interesting postulation. Do you realise that you are seriously asserting that the less you know about a subject, the better your understanding of it will be! Try that theory out reading the lane conditions at your next tournament, regardless of the ball you use. Try it out when you drill your next ball, etc., etc.
Try not to be silly.
Jim.
GeorgeF
Hypercell = Hyperhook!
Jim the problem with the 'older' generation of bowlers like yourself is that you dislike the current game because you have experienced the game in a different light (namely 30yrs+ ago) which you clearly prefer. The new generation of bowlers know nothing of rubber, lacquer lanes, etc
My son (8yrs) who loves bowling doesnt want a history lesson and hear me crap on about the good old days, he wants to throw the red Storm ball 2 handed and watch it hook the whole lane. He knows nothing of lanes conditions, he just enjoys throwing the ball and occasionally throwing some strikes and spares.
Most of Australia's league base is the same, people who just enjoy the sport in its current form who don't crap on about the good old days.
I enjoy the new technology, and most senior bowlers I know enjoy it to because it allows them to throw some extra angle and still throw the occasion honor score from time to time.
How about you enjoy the game for what it is today, yes it different but there's a whole new world of technologies you can learn which will benefit your game instead of living in the past. I respect and appreciate history and where the sport has gone, I may or maynot like it but we are not going backwards, enjoy today....
My son (8yrs) who loves bowling doesnt want a history lesson and hear me crap on about the good old days, he wants to throw the red Storm ball 2 handed and watch it hook the whole lane. He knows nothing of lanes conditions, he just enjoys throwing the ball and occasionally throwing some strikes and spares.
Most of Australia's league base is the same, people who just enjoy the sport in its current form who don't crap on about the good old days.
I enjoy the new technology, and most senior bowlers I know enjoy it to because it allows them to throw some extra angle and still throw the occasion honor score from time to time.
How about you enjoy the game for what it is today, yes it different but there's a whole new world of technologies you can learn which will benefit your game instead of living in the past. I respect and appreciate history and where the sport has gone, I may or maynot like it but we are not going backwards, enjoy today....
Troyza
Flash
Lol, I've bowled on wooden lanes primarilly up until this year. =P (resurfaced them too!)
How old is synthetic technology anyways?
Hi George,
I think that about sums it up. For the historian study the past, enjoy the history for what it is, the past. The path that lead us to where we are now.
For the league bowler like myself, any advantage is good. But we all have access to the same kit.
Personally for me, the history is nice to know, but the future excites me a lot more than the past.
I can't wait to see what is around the next corner.
John Velo
I think that about sums it up. For the historian study the past, enjoy the history for what it is, the past. The path that lead us to where we are now.
For the league bowler like myself, any advantage is good. But we all have access to the same kit.
Personally for me, the history is nice to know, but the future excites me a lot more than the past.
I can't wait to see what is around the next corner.
John Velo
Brenton_Davy
900Global bowler
The only downside to the technology is that it has blurred the gulf between the league players and the tournament players and this is why we struggle to get crowds to tournaments. Why would they come to a tournament to see guys shooting good numbers when they can do or see the same on any league night.
The technology has been to the benefit of the players allowing them to up their scoring pace, but it has damaged the image of tournament play in the eyes of the everyday league player. Probably a reason we struggle to attract lots of big money sponsors.
Don't get me wrong, I have benefited from the new technology as much as anyone else (or even more), it's the effect it's had on tournament players credibility that I have a problem with.
Brookie King
Member
Dear Mr Cross
I watched EJ bowl his last 300 from the next lane and it would not have mattered what ball he used..every shot was flush pocket !
And feel free to come to Innisfail and bowl on our current house pattern...you won't find a free 10 board area to aim at here.
Please, give some credit to the bowlers too as well as the balls and conditions.
Looking back thru TBA's records, I don't see a J.Cross amongst the list of recorded 300's !
Maybe you are in need of some of the new technology.
I watched EJ bowl his last 300 from the next lane and it would not have mattered what ball he used..every shot was flush pocket !
And feel free to come to Innisfail and bowl on our current house pattern...you won't find a free 10 board area to aim at here.
Please, give some credit to the bowlers too as well as the balls and conditions.
Looking back thru TBA's records, I don't see a J.Cross amongst the list of recorded 300's !
Maybe you are in need of some of the new technology.
AdrianS
This is the future!!!
Shayne Melton
Member
I was once told to read a book writen in 1978 on the correct set up and preperation of a race car. Almost every old man of motor racing has said that it is required reading for any serious driver....... Well I read this book. Not only was the book invalid to my current race car because of the 30 years of technoligy changes that had happened, I didn't go any faster by reading it either.
and reading this will make you a better bowler and bowl better scores ????????????
