2013 wide bay tournament suggestions

[Gympie Tenpin]

If anyone would like to ad posts to this site all sugestions will be aired at the wide bay meeting in nov.
Any sugestions on improving numbers for this event will be apreciated.
If you have a sugestion don't keep it to yourself

Thanks for your time
Peter Walsh

 

[jayboybriz]

Righto I'll kick this off as it seems I'm the keenest! After discussions with alot of the regulars on tour, a few ideas have come up that we hope will (a) increase numbers and (b) reward bowlers in the process:

1) Obviously cost has been mentioned and is an issue for some players.... A general consensus was that an entry fee of $150 would be a good move to increase numbers. Obviously if prize funds needed to be tweaked this would be understandable.
2) as we discussed to day, sponsorship needs to be readdressed but maybe in a different way due to the economic climate we are in at the present. My suggestion is that we corner one or two smaller hotel/motels at each stop and GUARANTEE them a full house in return for heavily discounted accommodation rates for traveling players. This costs the businesses nothing up front and gives them full occupancy so it should be not a bad selling point. Depending on the deal we could give them some flyer advertising as well.
3) another sponsorship item, although small - high game, raffle and/or lucky door type prize at each stop... Easy to do but gives more incentive to people who are obviously tumbling out of the running in some stops.
4) opening up to more independent centres... Toowoomba, Ballina, Harvey Bay and Kingaroy have been mentioned. I've heard stories but whoever is keen should be able to show us they can put on a decent show if they want it... Maybe proof of sponsorship is the first test each new centre must pass.

So this is just a few ideas we kicked around today. Not having a go at anyone or complaining- I've thoroughly enjoyed the tour and want to continue with it for a long time to come. Let's make this tour as prestigious as it used to be!

Jay

 

[Brad]

Thanks for this oppurtunity Peter,

I agree with you Jay but I didn't know how or who I should put it forward to. I know that I'm new to this tournament and I didn't want to tread on toes, that's why I was holding back.

This is the first time that I have bowled in a tournament of this nature and I want it to carry on cause of all the people that you meet at each event and I like playing against the bowlers that are up there with their game, cause it gives me something to aim for.

As Jay said in his post
(A) COST is a big issue, we need to get it back to a comfortable price where we are all happy with including the bowling centers, so that they don't loose money.
(B) PRIZE FUND PAYOUT what about the people that don't make the cut off and every time that happens they keep coming back time and time again. They get NO thanks what so every but yet they turn up to bowl and still have fun even at the end of the tournament they are on the bottom. We need to look after these people or you will loose them for good.

At the moment this is all I have but if I think of some other things that might help us keep it going, I'll put it up straight away.
Lets get behinde this so we can keep it going for ouor yoounger generation as well.

Brad

 

[jayboybriz]

Well said Brad. Another thing I noticed is that if you are in Brisbane, unless you are on totalbowling you have no idea this tour still exists. I think 'flyer' marketing needs to be done in as many centres as possible so that new players know about it. I was out of the loop of totalbowling until only last year.

 

[Baxter]

Hi Peter,

I agree with the previous posts... entry fee is probably the biggest thing. Increasing the entry fee this year to boost first place only appeals to a small group of bowlers, but discourages a huge number. I've lost count of how many people I've asked if they are going to bowl in one of the events and their answer is... I'm not paying $200 so Brendan, George, Hamo, etc can collect $1000. So maybe the top part of the prize fund needs to be reduced so the entry fee can come down.
The only other idea that comes to mind is taking out matchplay and making it straight pinfall wins. Less lineage should allow the cost to come down and depending on travel distance, take out the need for accommodation so save the bowlers some cash there too.

Darryl

 

[Gympie Tenpin]

Please keep the sugestion coming
I realise that everyone does not have acces to total bowling, so if you know anyone who isn't on total bowling and would like to know when and wher the events are.
Please get them to email me at gympie10pin.com.au and i will make sure all centres having tournaments shave your info. Before Nov would be good because then I can pass them on to the centres at the yearly meeting where next years tournaments will be discussed. Remember the more in put we have from you the beter. After all we only do this for you so help us make it better.
Otherwise just keep an eye on thi site for more info

Peter Walsh

 

[jk12x]

Hi Pete,

A few things:

1. Cost - Remove the guaranteed first place payout. Bowlers will not come if they are well aware they are only donating to a few elite bowlers. Payout should be more evenly distributed based on 1 in 3. Also, $200 is just a little too high entry fee - particularly considering travel and accommodation expenses.
2. Matchplay - All bowlers making the final matchplay format - min entry fee back.
3. Shorter qualifying - lets say 6 games qualifying (this should allow smaller entry fees). Bowlers can elect to go in a second squad if they wish to try and improve on their qualifying score.
4. Special 'desperado style' matchplay entry. Eg. Say top 15 make matchplay. Make top 14 automatically eligible. On second day prior to matchplay any bowler that wishes to take the 15th spot pays a 'desperado fee - say $20'. A one game winner take all for the 15th spot - (note: must have bowled one qualifying squad to be eligible for 'desperado').
5. Any sort of sponsorship ? So in country towns the bowl could approach their local accommodations for some sort of support. I am sure bowlers would support any suggested accommodation recommended by hosting centres for each tournament.
6. Local bowler bonus - Incentive to encourage local centre bowlers to participate. In house pre-tournament with prize of free spot for winner. Special award for first local bowler outside of cut.
7. Local bowler junior bonus - see point 6.
8. Raffles - small raffles during the tournament for fundraising and additional event interest.
9. Side pots - for squad bowlers - say $5 entry per bowler and bowlers compete during the qualifying for a separate cash prize payouts. Winners could be announced over the mic during qualifying to keep separate side pot interest and animation during tournament.

Perhaps a bigger thing is profile. These events should be marked and advertised within the local centres as 'premier events' featuring the best local open bowlers in qld. Hopefully, all open bowlers will get behind the circuit.

These are all just a couple of general thoughts - i am sure there are more and I would love Hammo to jump on and post. He had a lot of super ideas.

Thanks Pete for opening up the forum.

Cheers
JK

 

[hamster]

Thanks for dobbing me in Kingy.
I agree with all that entry is too high and the guarantee first place shouldn’t be guaranteed. I think alot of bowlers out there just want to compete without burning a big hole in their pocket.
Each stop should be treated as an event/spectacle. They also should be fast paced. I like the re-entry module that the EBT do. Gives bowlers the opportunity to make finals instead of their tournament being over half way thru qualifying.

Host centers should start small( numbers ) and then expand with demand. Not the other way around. Also they should put down their house pattern ( if it scores easy or hard so be it ).
To also get rid of a cost do we need to be accredited ? We don’t get any ranking points to the national program.
Add JK point 6.

Even keep matchplay/final short and sweet ( 1hr/1.5hr).
Is there a representative from the bowlers that goes to the meeting?

Will add later

Hammo

 

[jayboybriz]

Brilliant ideas by the big guys there. Not sure I fully support the idea of having no second stage as Darryl mentioned though, and would like to see the cost greatly reduced if we only started with a 6 game qualifier... I think half of the fun of these events is the anticipation of making the second day! Possibly a tournament style like innisfail would go well... 6 games.... Cut.... 6 more... Cut... Matchplay? Another great idea would be to have a different finals format for each stop.... For example the 'world cup' style that we saw earlier this year, an eliminator, a straight shootout, even a doubles tourney to finish the year.... These things could get notorious very quickly with the right noise!

 

[hamster]

Royal Rumble format I think they use it at Jnr Nationals

 

[Mark L]

Bring back Shayne and Stuart. The amount of work Shayne did to run the wide bay was huge and numbers showed. All the ideas you guys are talking about Shayne Melton was doing.
The centres and bowlers took advantage of this and didn't care now look what happened.
Scores from Stuart uploaded stright away made people watch online and made people talk about the tournaments.
Total bowling started this and it needed Jason and his support to keep it running. But again too much crap from centres and bowlers and he gone as well.
Animal and his bowling ball give away.
Some times centre owners need to take the help when is it offered before its too late.
So many great people were helping and no one cared.
I don't have the full story from both sides but when these guys were running the Wide Bay, well lets just say they never failed.
When you screw so many great people you end up with what you have now.
whats the answer, I don't know Maybe its to late now.

 

[jk12x]

Not very constructive Mark - actually a little disappointing. I certainly hope the too late now sentiment does not run true anyway.

I actually got into these tournaments because of Shayne and his involvement. One thing which appears to run true is that there is so much negativity and animosity towards everyone and everything in bowling - bowling centres, tournament directors - people who give there time with nothing in return and never get the proper recognition. That part is a shame.

However, bowling is a terrific sport. From my side, I got into bowling by watching videos of the most amazing American professionals, Walter Ray, PDW, Parker Bohn the list goes on. All of these guys seem to be true professionals - and excellent bowlers. Now whilst the animosity sucks, the game is terrific.

Is Wide Bay as good as it was or could be - of course not ! However, it's up to bowlers and centers to get together and see what can be done to keep it up and running. Ultimately, if it fails, we can all sit back and criticise. Let's do what we can to build a great idea.

No doubt it's the people behind the scenes that seem to make things work as well as they could. You mentioned Shayne and Stuart with Wide Bay. The same can be said about Mary and Twin Tour, and Brian Bates with anything that Caboolture puts on.

 

[jayboybriz]

There is tons of potential. All we need is the right product and attitudes

 

[Brad]

I would like to say that I agree with most of your comments and ideas. Mark lets stop the negativity and build on what Shayne and Stuart had been doing. We as bowlers need to put forward ideas on how to keep this tournament going right into the furture.

Some of the points that JK mentioned would be great, cause since I started this year I have not made the cut off, but it doesn't worry me. I do it for the love of the sport, so lets get behinde Peter and the rest of the crew that work endless hours behinde the scenes and hand over our ideas that we have so we can make it better for everyone thats involved.

So please lets get these ideas out and into the annual meeting.

Brad

 

[Brad]

There is tons of potential. All we need is the right product and attitudes

Jay you hit the nail on the head

 

[Rikki]

I think in todays world things are tight for everyone. is the $200 entry fee a bit to high? the numbers would say yes. This then opens a damned if you do damned if you dont. If you dont pay first place enough you dont get the high end bowlers if you dont pay down enough you dont get numbers entering. we have to find a middle ground.

I have bowled all of the wide bay so far this year i am enjoying the challenge and i have no expectations of winning. I love watching others bowl, read the lanes etc. For some reason bowlers seem like they dont want to step outside their comfort zone.

I could count on one hand the number of bowlers at Aspley that have entered only one of the wide bay events this year. Some of them are great bowlers with high potential. You can lead a horse to water but you cant make it drink.

Ill bet not many people even know its on.

Maybe next year the utilisation of facebook or twitter might get the message out better than just on total bowling. Even getting other centres to announce before a league or getting each centre to create its own little team to travel and share all costs.

Anyone can get on here and say he did she did blam this person that person but ultimatley its the bolwers that need to step up and support events like this even if its a hard centre to bowl in or to get too.

 

[nls]

Some really good points raised in thread so far. As someone who has bowled the tour every year sine 2007 (in both the Pearson & Melton-Crowley eras) and travelled more km's then most, i would love nothing more then see this tour strong again.

Some of my observations are :-

Numbers have dropped off since there is not someone being the 'face' of the circuit. In recent times it has been up to each centre to run there own event and now appears to be a number of single events rather then being seen as a true circuit. The lack of visible leadership/management of the series has also seen much reduced sponsorship. When Jase or Shayne were running it, they had numerous businesses that were sponsors of the entire series - yes each centre also got some sponsors for their local event but there was that secondary level of sponsorship for the series. The difficult thing will be getting someone to step up - both Shayne and Jase did a great job, but both felt burned after a couple of years from the politics of it all - something rare in this sport I know Fair to say that some of Mark's skepticism is borne out of some of the past politics.....

Entry forms out earlier.....in the glory days, with someone co-ordinating the circuit, at each event entry forms were there for the next event and someone actively collecting deposits.

Agree with Jon comments around bonuses for local bowlers / juniors etc, but each host centre should commit to promoting the whole series and try to get their local bowlers to bowl and the home event but also get them to travel to a few of the other events . Invariably you see a large number of people bowl 1 event but get them bowling 2, 3 or 4 the your series numbers are dramatically increased. When series first started it was me and 1 or 2 others from Rocky at them, after a year or 2 we had 8-10 at each event. Imagine the numbers in we had 7 or 8 centre doing the same - 10-15 centres doing that and you would have 3 full squads every time and a huge list of reserves......

Agree the 200 entry fee is a bit steep and perhaps work a way to get back to 150-160. I know in the past $10 from each entry has gone to Wide Bay group to cover end of season funds, but perhaps leave this in prize fund for each event (rely on sponsors where possible for season awards....I still use the GPS that I won from series awards a couple of years back)

Change formats around so it don't become predictable. Shayne has some really good concepts - some worked better then others but at least it was not the same every time. With centre based events a lot of the innovation has been lost.

Promotion of the series has also been a bit average (sorry to say but it has). Really need to use Facebook and total bowling a lot more. Even though I haven't been able to bowl this year I really look forward to seeing scores from each event but this year I don't think I have seen any (apart from caboolture open). Sure live scores were brilliant, but getting squad updates via TB create more interest. The more interest you create the more chance of more entries at the next event.

Crap... This would have to be the longest thread I have ever typed. My short attention span means I have usually tuned out by now, but hopefully this is helpful.

Cheers
Nathan

 

[Mark L]

Well said Nathan.
I hope you find that person to step up and take control, but to the centre owners let that person run the tournament.
Help that person promote your tournament, don't sit back and hope it works. Give that person something to reward them for all the effort they put in for you.
Face book and TotalBowling are good but the flyers need to be in every centre you can get them too, e-mails to every bowler you know.
As once said to me by a wise old man, why would you pay the same entry fee as you do for a ranked tournament with better payout.
Good luck to you all and hope it works out for you.

 

[Leesa]

I think you need to look at having some sort of ladies incentive to attractive more women to the tournaments. It doesn't have to be a separate prizefund but maybe like they do in the Victorian Sport Series, give the ladies an 8 pin per game handicap until they win an event then they lose the handicap for a year. It might entice a few more women to the tournaments if they think they have a chance at getting some money back.

I used to love bowling these tournaments until the entry fee increased and the ladies incentive disappeared.

 

[hamster]

Hey fellow jester, women bowlers need to be encouraged to bowl in the wide bay and i believe your suggestion is the way to go. Maybe tweak it a little with max being 8pins then reduced it by 4 for a win and maybe 2 for a cut. Then if they miss out the next stop increase it by 1 with 8 being the max.

hammo

still more to come