Restricted Challenge - DeVeer's Back?

[RobbieB]

Hi all,
Just got the tender forms for 2008 Nationals (yes, 2008!) and it appears that the Restricted Challenge is replacing the teams event that replaced De Veer this year and will be run on the same format as the Seniors Team Challenge.
Couldn't find anything on the TBA website about it though.

Given the poor attendence at this years Nationals, I'm interested to get some comments from ex- or current De Veer/Holt bowlers as to whether they will be supporting the new event or staying with the Holt Challenge.

Also, out of the 22 days allocated to the Championships in the suggested schedule, only 7 are allocated to Singles/Doubles/Teams, the rest are booked for rep team events and tournaments. This seems unbalanced to me, and suggests that the Nationals are getting away from being what the National Championships should be.

I know Wayne C raised the idea of making Nats 2 classifications only, and I am wondering if it would be desirable/feasable to run a Graded Nationals, incorporating DeVeer/Holt/Whatever for up to current A grade, and split off the Open Champs, Aust Masters and Rachuig as a separate event. Maybe TBA could get together with Peter Coburn and anoint his Holt Carnival as the Graded Nationals and let him take care of it (IF he'd want to, of course).

I can't see two competing teams tourneys drawing from the same pool of bowlers at the same time of year both being successful, but in its current form Nats probably relies on restricted bowlers to be a success financially, for both the host centre and TBA.

Flame away guys

Cheers, Robbie.

 

[rpac23]

7 days for S-D-T? That's basically destroying the championships part. I think TBA should return to the format they did last year in Moonah, Tasmania. Do Rahuig, de Veer, intercentre challenge and the masters events.

Either way, if the Nationals arn't in NSW, I ain't doin' them. I'm not travelling and taking more than a week off work to put up with the $#!+ we copped this year. Screw winning lollipops and lifesavers... i'll play the candy machine at the back if I want some of those. What a joke...

 

[Peter Coburn]

Let’s set things straight here - the Holt Challenge is not my creation. I can not take the credit for creating such a fantastic event. This event was formed by a group of very dedicated and disgruntled ex-WDV bowlers back in January this year who wished to keep an event much like the old WDV format on the national tournament calendar. Ronda, John and I were invited along to contribute to the event management side as apparently we have the skills to run a successful event on time and on budget.

However, I did have a recent meeting with a TBA Director, who was asked by TBA to discuss whether the Holt Challenge would return to the TBA Nationals. This question was then put to the Holt Challenge zone voting delegates so that a response could be returned to TBA.

The following is this committee’s official reply:

Holt Challenge Inc are unanimous that we do not wish to bring the Darrell Holt Restricted Challenge back to the TBA Nationals. This decision has been made on the grounds that we have already locked ourselves into the next two events and have secured substantial sponsorship and support for these years.

Additionally, and more importantly, this group has been betrayed by TBA before and do not wish to be placed in that position again. The Holt Challenge committee also has control of their own event rules, format and venues through the zone voting delegates. Effectively the bowlers have a say in this and if this group were to re-join the TBA Nationals then this is also surrendered.

The Holt Challenge has an expansion plan in place and this group feels that we should at least give this plan a chance before any alternates are looked at.

This group also feels that in the short term they do not wish to administer the Nationals on TBA’s behalf, since this will be to the detriment of their own event and its members. Accommodation, dinner dance venues, deposits, entry forms, sponsors, etc have already been implemented for 2008 and it would be at considerable cost if this was to be changed.

The 2008 Holt Carnival, including the Darrell Holt Restricted and Classic Challenges, will be conducted at AMF Cross Road in Adelaide from 9th to 18th September. The event schedule can be found on the official website - www.holtchallenge.org.au

 

[RobbieB]

Hi Peter,
Holt may not be your creation, but you are a major part of the management team in charge of running it. I apologise if I have upset anyone by calling it ýour' carnival; I'm really talking about the management team, not the initial organising committee.
One of the reasons that I posted was included in your reply - you and your team DO have "the skills to run a successful event on time and on budget" as proven by your performance with both TBA Nats and the Holt Challenge.
The Nationals should be a flagship event for the sport. Given the current climate, the best way for this to happen would be for TBA to outsource the running of the NAtionals to a proven expert management team.
Given the plans your committee has for a classic event, I still feel that it would be good for the sport to anoint the Holt Challenge as incorporating the TBA Nationals, so long as they allow the Holt Committee full control over the running and operation of the tourney.
To do this, it might be (politically) necessary to split it into classic/graded Nats and retain the open nats/Masters/Rachuig as a separate, stand alone event. I'd like to see you guys run that too, even though I know theres not a snowballs chance in hell of it happening.

Quote: 'This group also feels that in the short term they do not wish to administer the Nationals on TBA’s behalf'

I can understand why the Holt committee won't return to TBA. I like the 'short term' part of the above quote, though. Leaves us some hope for the future.

BTW, Peter, Townsville is a nice place for a carnival, and we'll give you a very nice game rate....

 

[Peter Coburn]

Hi Robbie,

At present the Holt Challenge venues for the future are set for 2008 (SA) & 2009 (ACT) and then after that the plan is to continue on a rotational basis through all the zones providing that there is a centre large enough in that zone to accommodate the event.

Basically Holt Challenge is following ATBSO, as there is significant overlap of participants to warrant this alliance and I believe that Queensland is pencilled in for 2010.

Cheers

 

[grumpie]

Now let me see, didn't TBA drop Deveer because it was perseaved as being full of cheats, Sandbaggers and whatever else anybody could think of.
I have always been a big supporter of Deveer but too many changes were made by TBA and then they droped it like a hot potato.
Holt comes along and looks good so they want to bring something along the same line back.
Maybe if they had a comittee running Deveer (with people that believed in it)the way it was instead of changing the format to how they thought was the best way only to destroy it.
Sorry but this puts TBA even further back in there thinking.:surrender: They may as well say they were wrong (in my eyes they were about Deveer).
A change at the top needs to happen for tenpin bowling to go forward as I now have less confidence in TBA now than ever before.

Gunther Czmok.

 

[Sydpies]

Well i have been saying for several months that the CEO and the TBA board should be sacked and resign. This leaderless committee are a waste of time and are destroying the very fabric that Tenpin Bowling was origianlly based on in this country.

WE need a NEW working committee with a delegate from each state and territory plus a CEO to put Australian Tenpin Bowling back on top for all the BOWLERS.
Joe T

PS. I think the Proprietors need to take back control and sack this current lot.

 

[grumpie]

PS. I think the Proprietors need to take back control and sack this current lot.

I don't think thats the answer, all you have to do is look at some of the Proprietors and there attitude to tenpin bowling as a sport. Some would rather social bowling and no leagues at all."League bowlers pay less, complain about conditions and spend less in the cafe."

At least League bowlers turn up every week

We need TBA in some form or another to adminastrate the sport.
Wether they do it the way we think is right is another thing.

Required is the best of both worlds. The elite bowlers then the majority of others. The 180 and blow average bowlers need these tounies to give them encouregement to get to the elite level if they can make it or even get close.


So tournies like this are needed!!!!!!!!!!

Gunther Czmok

 

[Brenton_Davy]

I don't think thats the answer, all you have to do is look at some of the Proprietors and there attitude to tenpin bowling as a sport. Some would rather social bowling and no leagues at all."League bowlers pay less, complain about conditions and spend less in the cafe."
At least League bowlers turn up every week
We need TBA in some form or another to adminastrate the sport.
Wether they do it the way we think is right is another thing.
Required is the best of both worlds. The elite bowlers then the majority of others. The 180 and blow average bowlers need these tounies to give them encouregement to get to the elite level if they can make it or even get close.
So tournies like this are needed!!!!!!!!!!
Gunther Czmok

Gunther,

At least the Proprietors representative body, the ABPA are trying to promote bowling as a sport by sponsoring the Tenpin Bowling Show. Sure there are some individual Proprietors/Managers that have that attitude, but at least their representative body appears to have a different outlook, and this may give us hope for the future.